Ostruppen Doctrine in 2v2s

This is only true if you think each flamethrower is the same as a pio or engi flamethrower. In all actuality thats not true. 2 pioneers with flamethrowers have higher damage output than the FHT. Quite a while ago before the heavy t3 requirement nerf. The flamethrowers were nerfed into oblivion. Also crit potential is not much higher as far as I know its the exact same. Feel free to prove me wrong. Its better than 1 flamepio squad, but not by a lot. These units having nothing to due with axis search numbers. The majority of axis players are okw anyway. So I'm not sure what your point is there???
The incendiary rounds for the mg42 are not a viable counter at all vs the m5 which is basically impervious to small arms fire compared to the 251. . Which isn't a big deal really. Just that the fact that 222 and 251 are very squishy when they already don't pose much of a threat in terms of firepower.

Despite the incendiary rounds doing very well vs light vehicles, vs competent players its very unlikely that you'll ever counter these vehicles in this way. Its merely there to punish low level players and for fun. Due to light vehicles having to sit right in front of an mg while it loads the incendiary rounds which is rather obvious if you can read the situation. Most people stay at range anyway.

If it were up to me. I would change the 251 as so:
Armor from 9 to 11-12
Flammenwerfer no longer requires t3.
Damage of flammenwerfer increased by 15%.

Yes, my point was that you mentioned bullet damage. If we are going to use the competent player argument, we can also throw out the idea that a 251 will be killed by bullet fire unless the player is simply overwhelmed. Either way, the 251 is not more likely to die to bullet fire than M5.

What I meant with the finishing potential being higher is that it is a mobile vehicle. It can chase infantry to hell and back. It also has longer range.

Flamethrower is also the only reliable way to vet the halftrack up, and it gets veterancy quite quickly. If we use the Luftwaffe supply conversion rate of 4 MP for 3 munitions, it costs 160 Manpower. That is 8 conscript models, or roughly Unless you spontanenously lose it, which can and does happen at least in my level of play, that is not a lot for it to kill in order to be cost effective.


I agree with Flammenwerfer not requiring T3, but I think the Halftrack is fine otherwise, as someone who uses it every game with no exceptions. Until recently I have been in the same boat as with the Flamethrower being worthless, but I found out that not keeping your expectation too high and letting it move in when it is not actively being threathened is the way to get the most out of it.

You are however ranked far higher than I am and the Flamethrower Halftrack is indeed a rarity, so I may be wrong in thinking that is fine. I just wasn't disappointed by it as much as I thought I would have been.

Yes, my point was that you mentioned bullet damage. If we are going to use the competent player argument, we can also throw out the idea that a 251 will be killed by bullet fire unless the player is simply overwhelmed. Either way, the 251 is not more likely to die to bullet fire than M5.

What I meant with the finishing potential being higher is that it is a mobile vehicle. It can chase infantry to hell and back. It also has longer range.

Flamethrower is also the only reliable way to vet the halftrack up, and it gets veterancy quite quickly. If we use the Luftwaffe supply conversion rate of 4 MP for 3 munitions, it costs 160 Manpower. That is 8 conscript models, or roughly Unless you spontanenously lose it, which can and does happen at least in my level of play, that is not a lot for it to kill in order to be cost effective.


I agree with Flammenwerfer not requiring T3, but I think the Halftrack is fine otherwise, as someone who uses it every game with no exceptions. Until recently I have been in the same boat as with the Flamethrower being worthless, but I found out that not keeping your expectation too high and letting it move in when it is not actively being threathened is the way to get the most out of it.

You are however ranked far higher than I am and the Flamethrower Halftrack is indeed a rarity, so I may be wrong in thinking that is fine. I just wasn't disappointed by it as much as I thought I would have been.

You are not wrong, its just not really an important vehicle at all. Because of that slight improvements to the vehicle in the main areas would do nothing but good. Its good for supporting through mobile reinforcement, but there is just no reason not to make it slightly more effective offensively. Its one of those units that could actually be a viable early game unit for ostheer that would be balanced. You would see more variety in ostheer playstyles, especially vs americans. It would still be countered by all light vehicles but just better vs infantry.

In fact if the 222, FHT, mg42, panzerwerfer, brummbar cost decrease, your assorted doctrinal units like ass grens, and sniper all just had the appropriate buffs, then I'm fairly certain the teching prices would not be an issue. The whole reason they seem like an issue is because people feel that they can only be truly comfortable with lmg grens, paks, panzer 4s, tigers, and panthers. This is very low variety of reliable units, directly causing the stale meta. Every unit needs to be just the right bit effective in there respective areas relative to other units, price, and average timing of entry into the game.

This way the ostheers units are as effective as you expect them to be while the factions draw back is pricy teching, because right now a lot of units don't perform reasonably due to very slight UP aspects that collectively add up. Because I'm really against overbuffing combined with cheap teching which leads to synergy that might be too effective for the wrong price. OKW for example. Cheap teching and slow fuel income combined with great defensive vet modifiers leads to surplus manpower accumulating from the mid game onward. The USF is the same starting from the early game but just to a lesser degree. I don't wanna see the ostheer easily able to field all there best units, but I also want to see some variety. I'd really much rather every unit perform effectively with the main drawback being teching price.

I'm just going to throw this out but Ostruppen needs to A) get the panzerfaust ability without needing tier 1 structure to make them a viable tier 2 tier 3 tech.

They need some sort of weak nade ability maybe potato mashers like in coh 1? where they can be thrown far but don't do much damage.

I mean partisans come with Motolovs, AT nades, etc

It has been powerful. Why?

1) You dont struggle that much for stupid munitions
2) Osttruppen is dirt cheap = keep up with tech
3) No more 1 shot squad wipe!!!

and IMO Tiger is a huge piece of shit anyway. Elefant is the only callin that worths something

Agreed exactly on all 3 points.
Add 4rth point,make ameri blob whine with strafe.They are so used to rolling over every infantry fight against ost,suddenly its a problem.

Agreed again on tiger.I no longer build it at all.Only panther and elefant are reall lategame armor for ost.Both jacksons and is-2 which are the endgame units for usf and soviet laugh at tiger.P-47 skillplane says and goodbye often.Its a waste unless enemy solely blobbing infantry
Once tech is fixed,IF its fixed,that is if they want to keep the faction around...i gurantee u will not see any tigers..just panthers.