Lil Help?

Hey guys, im wondering if i could get a bit of an analysis on this replay. I have taken a long break from CoH but picked it up recently mainly to get ready for Coh2. When i played years ago i wasn't really very good only making it up to around lvl8 Americans. I never played any other factions. This time around i figured i would play Wehrmacht to try something new. Anywho, Ive played 27 games and am 11-16 so far. Its not a great record and i seem to have some issues getting used to this faction.

I know there are several basic things wrong with my gameplay. Any comments from the most basic to more detailed strategies that i could improve would be greatly appreciated. The thing i need most is practice and repetitions...

Replay

bump...lil help??

Sure, I'll take a look.

Edit: Meh, I have to reinstall old version. Do you have any on 2.7?

This was 2.7, the steam version...

This was 2.7, the steam version...

Ah, ok. GR is still listing it as 602. I'll go check it out now.

Ok, I watched this a few times now, and have taken some time to gather my thoughts on this for you. Hopefully you don't take offense or overlook my efforts. In summary this one came down some fundamentals as wehrmacht.

That is:

1.) Unit preservation. Lost pios early, and I actually lost count of how many entire volks squads you lost so carelessly, and they were all "left out to dry". They were moved into very unwinnable situations by ignoring range and cover, as well as overextending desperately undermanned and wounded squads deep into hostile territory, alone, with no recon. The results of those endeavors speak for themselves.


2.) Micro and understanding of cover, damage and range... (i.e. the volks in flamethrower range from garrisoned engies (x2), out of cover, low health squads alone and not retreated, capping underfire with no cover, etc, etc.

3.) Mines. You need to plant them. Moreover, you took some serious casualties to them, the first mine should've alerted you to make a mine detector, if not before, because the higher the levels, the more mines you should expect to see regardless, especially on maps like semois with endless choke points and claustrophobic streets and town centre.


The very early game is where this took a bad turn. You managed to annihilate a engy squad and cap the close side, but in doing so you left your cutoff exposed, the middle unscouted, let alone defended, and pushed volks early to areas behind "enemy lines" so to speak, and got surrounded and engaged at close range against far superior forces...thus forced to retreat, or completely annihilated. This while sending your MG42 alone to the far side munitions where a pio squad was ignored and died capping a point, bad unit preservation and mg deployment, imho. Also would have waited on the medbunk a bit longer, as it was too little too late, as you had already vanished much of your men, and if you had preserved your squads better, the MP and muni would have been better spent on that sniper getting out earlier, replenishing volks squads, and getting a mine detector.


Quick tips;
*You want your volks to be more defensive in firefights, preferably standing with cover at a longer distance to rifles, and not generally exploring alone in terrain and situations very unfavourable to their survival.

*Retreat weak and undermanned squad to refit for action. This is especially key for volks as opposed to say, riflemen.

*Don't be afraid to use medpacks in lieu of waiting for vet 1. Though it can hamper medbunk or mine production, it can also prevent you from giving up ground and loosing entire squads, which are much more important.

*Typically it's best to not send mg42s scouting ahead alone, as well as to garrison them, for it makes it even easier to flank and annihilate. Usually better to use cover at an angle, on terrain which limits flanks, or much more preferably still, using them in tandem with some sort of scout, or infantry ahead of them. Bikes are great in this regard, for not only the significant added visual range, but also to prevent flanks by physical pushing. It's usually a good idea to redeploy your mg after every engagement it faces to prevent easy flanks, as well as actively bring them into the fight with supporting infantry, and not left to hold ground by itself.


*Never cap underfire. It's just a rule of thumb. You lose at least 20% of your firepower with volks, and are more susceptible to incoming fire by typically not being in cover while capping.

*Mines. Mines. Mines. Plant them, detect them.


Not going to necessarily suggest build orders or "strats" so much, but I will share with you how I often go about it. Understand until the fundamentals are mastered, it doesn't matter what build or strat you do, you're going to come out on the loosing end more times than not, imho.

I typically only want or need 1 mg, using two becomes very difficult to employ and micro to their full potential, and often is a waste of MP in such a case. Some volks are fine, but you can't lose them! I often go bike first to scout for the first rifle so the MG coming next can get an early retreat. By that time volks are out to support the MG and cap ahead (per german doktrine ), not the other way around. I will often then get 2 snipers after 2 volks to deal heavy drain on rifle heavy users (see: everyone) This will typically trade some map control, for attritional play, which can later allow me to get to cutoffs with a better chance of sustaining the push because of us retreating and reinforcing. I personally often ignore map control (to an extent!) on several maps as wehr, because I choose to focus to one side or the other, and prefer to deal high damage and cut off supplies to dictate the tempo of the game to my liking. Wehr is forgiving in this regard, and some map combos make this more advantageous than not...see: "wehrtrain"

I hope this helps some.

Esky, what would you say about my play as American, given you've already watched the replay? you can do a 2-1 here on the same replay.

Esky, what would you say about my play as American, given you've already watched the replay? you can do a 2-1 here on the same replay.

Ok, sure. I would say your play as american was good...and bad. First, let it be known I'm not nearly as good as US. As I watched, I kept wondering why the US player didn't get bars and backtech to WSC sooner for a sniper, and especially get a medic station up to keep up with the ever evolving german infantry, and the casualties being mounted on your side. In reality, the game was won by you in the first 8 minutes imho, and was yours to lose from then on. By the mid/late game there was a real chance for a german comeback due to the extreme high casualty rates you were suffering, and the inability to finish off the game at that stage.

My advice is to not lose focus of the game at hand, and to stay aggressive throughout. Stacking M10s behind the front lines waiting to counter attack isn't necessarily as helpful as keeping the pressure on and preventing a serious attack to unfold to begin with... this, however, doesn't mean doing sacrificial base rushes.

Key mistakes:
*Prolonged and recurrent resource floating. (Those resources would have, again, been served well to get a medic station up, get bars, and backtech to WSC to drain the wehr dry. A couple different times you had enough to do all of the above in one blow, but opted for armour or other upgrades/rangers.)

*Needless sacrificing/inattention to units. One glaring example was the men you had men just chillin' and soaking up damage and death from the ostwind during the tank skirmish. There were numerous infantry engagements in the later portion of the game where you had a slim to none chance of winning (again, thanks to no bars or wsc support), but stuck around to take serious losses anyways.

*Relying on grenades. Not good enough, especially against vetted grens with a good microing opponent. Also, it is not worth the risk to keep a highly wounded and undermanned squad in the fight just long enough to throw a grenade, of dubious effectiveness. (Rangers, looking at you.)

*Mines. You had some very effective mines in the early stages, but sort of lost favour for grenades and an offmap or two, of little effectiveness. Remember mines are just as valuable in the late game, specifically with the ability to single handedly stall attacks by crippling tanks, suppressing infantry, and thinning blobs. If you noted, the axis player didn't much bother for sweepers, and thus any and all chokepoints when mined, even securely behind the lines, would have stalled even a sure comeback from occurring.

*Tank micro. There's not much point in just rushing up to infantry and chilling to shoot at them. As allies tank crushing is an extremely powerful tool vs infantry, especially shreks. You took a lot of unnecessary damage a couple times. If you're not comfortable rushing in for the crush, a moving tank, at range, is extremely hard to hit. Especially when screened with rifles. ( See: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQfQP5CKOxY ) and of course, as I'm sure you know, shermans and m10s are most effective against the rear of german armor. Combined arms is the name of the game once you have armor.

It seems as though you started to over focus on hard tank counters when in reality you don't have to kill every german tank to win games, in fact, I rarely do when it comes to panthers at the end of a game. Just disabling and stalling them to need repairs usually works just fine, and keeps the popcap and upkeep tied up in doing so. An arguable point, but it works for me not to get overzealous with m10s and up gunning when I am loosing the crucial infantry battles.

Overall you did a great job, right up until you had it won...By that, I mean you pretty much had the german player right where you wanted him, but you didn't finish him decisively. You started to "settle in", and accept casualties, I'm assuming, just to stall him? I don't know, but it's not a good idea to ease off the throttle too much, and then let your rifles get hammered. Especially while floating massive resources and without medic and aid stations to stop the bleeding.

(Pun intended. )

oops double post.

Thanks Esky! I thought i had lost the game after i lost a couple squads early but i managed to "hang in there". As soon as that happens are start yelling at myself because im very aware of how bad it is yet i still let it happen!!! Anywho, this gives me some good feedback to go off of. One of the worst things i do is spread my army too thin (must be US habits still there) and i don't check or notice when i get mined...

Thanks Esky, much appreciated that you took the time to have a look and give some feedback. You've kind of summed up a good number of games I've played and lost. I get myself into a great position early in games and then, if i'm against someone who knows what they are doing, let it slip from my grasp. I think early on there are less units, less squads to keep an eye on and it's easier to micro, as more units come onto the field i lose concentration and can't keep control of the whole battlefield. I also think i don't know how to best close a game, whether to go fast M8, maybe WSC,or even tank depot when I'm in a winning position and kind of react to what i see rather than them having to react to me.

Anyway enough of me rambling, thanks again.

Just wanted to say that Ive tried to incorporate your inputs and ive been improving significantly because of it. I think im finally getting how to play with the Wehr army and my win rate has definitely gone up! Ive still got work to improve to "smooth" timings and mechanics, but im looking better for CoH2! Thanks again

Just wanted to say that Ive tried to incorporate your inputs and ive been improving significantly because of it. I think im finally getting how to play with the Wehr army and my win rate has definitely gone up! Ive still got work to improve to "smooth" timings and mechanics, but im looking better for CoH2! Thanks again

Thats good to hear! Luckily for you and your volks death squads, coh2 is way more forgiving when it comes to gibbing your own squads. The timing/teching/mechanics are all learned and dealt with over time, first and foremost is the basics as outlined earlier. Good luck!