Some words about the hate against Relic

Hello guys,

I am a member of this forum for over a year now and even longer of the German version (HQ-CoH) and I often find myself reading things how much Relic sucks and that they are awful at supporting this game. Reading all those things made me also believing this kind of stuff and I found myself thinking 'omg what does this damn idiot say again...' whenever I read a post from Noun or anyone else of the CoH-staff.

Now I saw some videos of this year's gamescon and somehow I now feel guilty for my thoughts. Sure some presentations went really wrong but you know what? They are also just people doing their jobs and the cool thing is that they are even having fun doing it (most of the time I guess). Some of them are shy and don't know how to behave in front of a camera and I was wondering if I could do any better in their positions. I saw the videos and thought 'hey, they are not the bad guys I always thought they were'. In fact they are proud of the game they made and want to share it with the people (sure they also have to make the money but who of you works for free?).

I have to say that I am a person who is influenced by other's opinions and postings very fast so I had the image of the bad and evil Relic staff in my head for a very long time. Everytime a new patch arrived I thought 'oh god these idiots make it even worse' and such things.
But guys (and girls) always remember that Relic is a very small team of people who do this for a living. It is no 1.000 people coporation with 3 different sections for design, gameplay and so on, so they have to split their resources if they want to work on multiple projects at once.

Sure the balancing of CoH2 is another thing to debate about but I find it awful how many people in this forums insult the team and this is not okay.
Criticism is very important. But it makes a huge difference how you say it.

I hope we all can live in peace and fight our wars on the CoH battlefields.
Best regards.

+1000000

Couldn't agree more Gut geschrieben

Blaming the dev´s is always easier than admit a own mistake.

The hate doesn't help achieve anything. But it's internet and you can say everything to everyone. Kids these days...

The game starts with scandal and still got some hate from gamers. Why? You don't need to go deeper - all in the forums. Yep, most of flame here are zero worthed but sometimes someone is shining.

As for "small team of people" - we living in 2014 year, not in 1995 then WarCraft2 was showed. Industry GOT SO MUCH good ideas for rts - why Relic ignoring them?

They want to push game to eSports - but it impossible. For now. eSport games SHOULD be acsessible and able to get simple info about any aspect of the game. Look at the League of Legends - they got site with full info about heroes, items and so on. Same in the game - you can get ALL the info most of the time. And what we have here? 0.5 support with customers, ninja changes EVERY patch and not-so-easy(or even worse words) table in GOGGLE DOC about units...

So. The hate will continue till game evalite to modern standarts.

The forum warriors need the hate to fuel themself with rage to fight furyously on the forum battlefields.

+1000 from me too!

I think there are reasons for which they it deserved.
bad feedback. not historicity.
and for the Russian community - a direct insult for obvious russophobia and lies.

People just lack patience. A game, especially a balanced one, is not something that comes over night in one patch. you have to try and then try again until everything fits as it should, and adding two major factions like they did only a few months ago makes them start from scratch.
The people who then start yelling "OMG it was so good before and now it sucks, you guys suck" should just leave, because most of the time, these are people who dont have patience, and dont play it for a longer time than the one week, where they play it dead and then move on to another game!
Totally agree with your post!

I think there are reasons for which they it deserved.
bad feedback. not historicity.
and for the Russian community - a direct insult for obvious russophobia and lies.

Oh, and the hate against the Germans in every fucking media is okay then, but bashing the russians once, and everybody loses their minds
Nah, come on, its just a game, and the russians were bad, that is proven. That they exaggerate for the sake of drama is not something people should whine about. srsly....

I think that if you do historical game, you have to be the most correct. and where your praised western tolerance? instead developers declared that their game completely historical. as a result they were incompetent and used usual promotion. any normal historian will tell you it.it is too much promotion and a lie

OP, you really need to brush up on terms.

Company, Product, Employee, Customer, Customer satisfaction and Person.

While I agree that personal insults are not ok, insulting and swearing at Relic is just fine.

Relic is a company that is owned by large corporation, and those 2 entities only care about money.
Furthermore staff at Relic are their employees and they do what they are told by their bosses and so on.

Being nice to a company is just plain stupid because company has no feelings and will never change anything unless it's profit margins are affected.
Just because certain employee is nice on youtube video or cares about game it doesn't mean he is capable of doing anything without permission from bosses. And bosses won't authorize spending $2 on making you happy unless they benefit somehow.

Cheers

http://www.coh2.org/replay/24250/me-breaking...brad.

Good thread asshole. Relic style.

I think that if you do historical game, you have to be the most correct. and where your praised western tolerance? instead developers declared that their game completely historical. as a result they were incompetent and used usual promotion. any normal historian will tell you it.it is too much promotion and a lie

I havent played the campaign for a while and cant fully remember it, but wasnt it about the red army being inhuman and stuff? I dont know if the events in the game are exactly true, but the red army WAS inhuman, and commited a lot of warcrimes, also on their own men. But the Soviet Union has always been good at hiding those facts, just like it isnt common knowledge that Stalin commited massacres all over the Soviet Union.
Every media shows germans as the worst of all people and are also exaggerating a lot at times. Yet one game does the same to the Russians and the game gets boycotted in Russia. I find it ridiculous!

It is frustrating when you watch the Relic twitch where the audio is messed up stream after stream or when bugs like ghostwire appear in vcoh, vcoh2 and in WFA again!
Relic is a small studio so holidays have quite a big impact but it is hard to stay patient when many bugs are around for so long

Obviously this doesn't warrant the stupid namecalling but it does kind of explain the cynicism here.

The main problems are scapegoating and a general sense of negativity. I'm not saying I'm flawless (just kidding, I am \o/), a certain Relic Dev tends to call me Negative Nancy and I guess that's not without a reason. It's all in good humor though (I hope ).

People tend to blame rather certain individuals than the company as a whole, even if those persons are just acting on orders. Peter and Braden are the primary persons getting blamed for balance issues, Brad also for bad manner. Noun takes all the FlaK for community interaction. All of them regularly get criticised for their secretism.

Those people are humans and they like the game and are dedicated. I've played countless games with Devs after hours and discussed balance as well as general CoH issues with them. In their free time. In the Western Fronts Alpha they completely overhauled the Oberkommando faction 2 (or 3 times) due to the player input. We had daily meetings on Mumble discussing changes and usually they got implemented pretty fast. They take the criticisms and suggestions seriously and listen to them. A lot of the changes that were done to certain units stem from players showing the problems to them. Sometimes I wish they'd listen better and you wouldn't have to shove it in their face, but at least if you do, they react.

Before now anyone again complains about the 'special treatment' - just look at the forums. There is so much noise, it wouldn't work. A lot of the Alpha people read the forums and link to 'good' threads in the public forums or bring suggestions to Relic directly.

My biggest problems with Relic are usually the priorities and some general structure issues. I don't think I can talk about those things publicly. They just seem to have too many projects running at once and lack the manpower to handle everything the community wants from them. Still, even though Relic is sometimes slow to improve or adapt, it seems to improve a bit. If I compare the community interaction now to the one at launch? Forum posts, Twitch streams. Better patch presentations. An Alpha to let parts of the community present feedback more directly and test improvements. Besides that also changes in CoH2 itself - Less commander DLC releases and a War Spoils system (which is by far not perfect, but a lot of people asked for free ways to get commanders). A map rotation to showcase community maps, custom games. Obs mode in development. Of course also something a lot of people forget and which was a major improvement - battle servers. As I mentioned earlier, that's a lot of different projects and most of them (to me) feel half-finished. It's like they want to add all those cool things, but do not have the time or manpower to really polish them :/

I havent played the campaign for a while and cant fully remember it, but wasnt it about the red army being inhuman and stuff? I dont know if the events in the game are exactly true, but the red army WAS inhuman, and commited a lot of warcrimes, also on their own men. But the Soviet Union has always been good at hiding those facts, just like it isnt common knowledge that Stalin commited massacres all over the Soviet Union.
Every media shows germans as the worst of all people and are also exaggerating a lot at times. Yet one game does the same to the Russians and the game gets boycotted in Russia. I find it ridiculous!

Your post - I find it ridiculous.

They just seem to have too many projects running at once and lack the manpower to handle everything the community wants from them.

Sorry but this isn't community problem, right?

What devs are thinking about then they making a sturmpioneers, who could

- massed damage at any range
- no penalty for rough terrain
- ability to cut wire
- ability to build uncutable wire

ehh?

I'm not complaining about OP-units for axis side, couse I always love to adapt my play after each patch. But, hey - sometimes I think what dev team should take CASUAL aproach to the game.

Keep it clean please.