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The Usf's need for elite infrantry

14 Aug 2014, 05:14 AM
#21
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned


The faction isn't designed to punch you in the mouth with elite infantry. You have weapon upgrades for your rifles to help them scale into the late game. As has been mentioned before, paras w/ m1919s are amazing, arrive before obers, can deploy anywhere, and reinforce in the field at the same cost as rifles. The infantry commander basically turns your rifles into elite infantry at the same cost of an LMG or BAR.

An argument could be made that the strength of rifleman (and the USF in general) needs to be a little less polarizing, with their early game toned down and their scaling increased, but this would take away much of the flavor of the faction. In 1v1s this creates a really fun and interesting dynamic.

In team games it is much harder to really push your early game advantage, and many players feel frustrated when playing the USF because you really can't afford to sit back and let the battle come to you. The clock is ticking, and you need to win early. The USF is not an easy faction to play, and I think giving them units that deliberately fill the intended holes of the faction is going to be bad for balance and design. Giving the USF a Pershing would be insane, because no other faction has access to such a versatile T4 to back it up with. Just as giving the USF elite infantry would be over the top because they already have so much flexibility with their rifleman and their upgrades, it would feel redundant imo.


I dont know why u brought the pershing up? but ok. I think if USF get rangers or something it should be similar to the captain. the captain CANNOT pick up any weapons unless a bazooka man is lost. And for regards to the pershing, I think it would be fine to add. If relic reworks ostheer t4. Which is pretty usless in 1v1
14 Aug 2014, 05:15 AM
#22
avatar of QueenRatchet123

Posts: 2280 | Subs: 2

Permanently Banned
14 Aug 2014, 05:35 AM
#23
avatar of FestiveLongJohns
Patrion 15

Posts: 1157 | Subs: 2



I dont know why u brought the pershing up? but ok. I think if USF get rangers or something it should be similar to the captain. the captain CANNOT pick up any weapons unless a bazooka man is lost. And for regards to the pershing, I think it would be fine to add. If relic reworks ostheer t4. Which is pretty usless in 1v1



I brought up the Pershing because it falls in line with other similar requests to borrow themes from other factions that don't fit into the USF design. I don't think we need another IS-2/Tiger clone in the game. The USF and OKW are unique factions, and bringing in one more heavily armored, well rounded, effective against all targets, late game monster tank is boring and takes some of the flavor away from the USF. Again, this is just my opinion, but honestly the units you are suggesting for the USF makes me think that you should just play the soviets.
14 Aug 2014, 07:39 AM
#24
avatar of aradim

Posts: 110

Unless you lost 2 riflemen squads you should never call in paratroopers.
14 Aug 2014, 08:06 AM
#25
avatar of Auryt

Posts: 7

I think USF the only thing NOT need is that :D

Rifleman with 2x BAR: good
Rifleman with 2x M1919: beast
Paratrooper with 2x M1919: terminators and outclass every infrantry (manpower wise much better than obers).
14 Aug 2014, 08:13 AM
#26
avatar of Crysack

Posts: 70

I don't necessarily agree with the premise of this thread, but I will say that I think Paras are borderline-useless. They're prohibitively expensive when you take the mandatory 120 munitions into account and they come at a point in the game where you already have 3+ rifles, a captain or LT (or both)as well as at least a single pathfinder squad to actually place the beacons. Getting more inf squads at that point is just asking to have your MP bled down to nothing - and you should be working up to AT or light/medium armour at that point anyway. In the rare instances that I use the Airborne doctrine, I would only ever get Paras if I happen to lose a few rifle squads - which probably means I'm screwed anyway.
14 Aug 2014, 08:32 AM
#27
avatar of HappyPhace

Posts: 309

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Aug 2014, 08:13 AMCrysack
I don't necessarily agree with the premise of this thread, but I will say that I think Paras are borderline-useless.


They really aren't though.

They're prohibitively expensive when you take the mandatory 120 munitions into account and they come at a point in the game where you already have 3+ rifles, a captain or LT (or both)as well as at least a single pathfinder squad to actually place the beacons.


You can time it so that your first munitions dump is reserved for paras. BARS for all rifles is honestly a secondary priority over getting your paratroopers LMGs ASAP.

Getting more inf squads at that point is just asking to have your MP bled down to nothing - and you should be working up to AT or light/medium armour at that point anyway.


True, the build order I posted, 4 rifles -> captain -> Stuart -> Paras/ATG and then into T4 is the safest build you can go, ample AT and AI for the mid game.
14 Aug 2014, 09:29 AM
#28
avatar of Kronosaur0s

Posts: 1701

Double M1919 vet 3 rifles is all you need.
14 Aug 2014, 09:52 AM
#29
avatar of Burts

Posts: 1702

Thing is, airborne with double m1919 ARE your elite infantry.

Infact, they are the BEST elite infantry in the game, they BEAT EVERY single axis infantry unit and have the same reinforce cost as rifleman, making them INCREDIBLY efficent.
14 Aug 2014, 11:29 AM
#30
avatar of Severino

Posts: 38

Lol to this whole thread. Maybe they should give OKW some good versatile riflemen equivalents that can get lmgs or shreks and cost 280mp. Also a medium tank would be nice.
14 Aug 2014, 11:37 AM
#31
avatar of Rage_of_the_reich

Posts: 65

USF shouldn't complain about infantry at all ....

Goddamn, BARs or 1919 Mg's on Rifles or even Airborn is absolutly devastating to the Oberkommando when evething apart from Obers won't even stand a small chance to win an engagement.

You have to consider that the Ostheer only has very weak grens and Pgrens (on a level with sturms *lol)and you complain about Rifles and Airborne?????
14 Aug 2014, 14:46 PM
#32
avatar of thebaymonster

Posts: 35

I play airborne, and I play them A LOT. The para troopers are the best infantry in the game, imo. I use the dual lmgs to pretty much wipe any other infantry squad at range, and if I'm defending in an area where I can hide close quarters, I give them Thompsons.

U.S. infantry are definitely amazing.

I think they're armor is great too, because you can spam them in greater numbers even though they're weaker. I honestly think that the only problem with USF is their .50 cal. I wish it was available immediately instead of having to be unlocked for a tier I DON'T use (yes, I don't use the halftrack, crazy I know).

I love the balance of the game, currently.
14 Aug 2014, 15:10 PM
#33
avatar of sneakking

Posts: 655

Permanently Banned
I'm kind of on the fence about the whole issue, I think there is considerable arguments on both sides of this. But what I can say for sure is Paratroopers are FAR from useless/UP. 1919 Para's really are devastating even into the late game, and the only infantry that effectively counters them is Vet 4-5 OKW heavy infantry. Wehrmacht Grens and Pgrens can't hold a candle to Paras, unless blobbed.

I'm determined to wipe an OKW blob with the timed demo charge.
14 Aug 2014, 17:03 PM
#34
avatar of ofield

Posts: 420

jump backJump back to quoted post14 Aug 2014, 03:24 AMJadame!

I believe rangers would be added at some point, but thats is. Playing USF means playing rifles. If you want shocks play soviets.


Or equip Airbornes with Thompsons -> strongest cqc Squad ingame.
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