Quick question which is self explanatory. Grenadiers seem to be pretty weak against rifles and just about any soviet infantry even behind heavy cover, whereas the Panzer Gren dps is insane up close though they usually lose a couple of men before they can close the gap.
So are Panzer Grens mainly just for tank busting and standard Grens mostly just needed to rush LMG or G43 to stand a chance against allied infantry?
Side note: Are G43's better all round vs LMG upgrade?
Are Grenadiers or Panzer Grens the main infantry unit?
12 Aug 2014, 11:37 AM
#1
Posts: 44
12 Aug 2014, 11:58 AM
#2
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
- For defensive actions, LMG will be better cause it does good damage but need to not move.
- For offensive actions / flanking, G43 will be better, cause you can shoot on the move.
- For offensive actions / flanking, G43 will be better, cause you can shoot on the move.
12 Aug 2014, 14:43 PM
#3
Posts: 1225
Are you the Biosparks of CoH1 fame?
Anyways, Grens are your mainline infantry. In 90 percent of all cases you will want to go for LMG upgrades...G43s increase short-mid range DPS at the cost of long range firepower, but they still won't enable your Grens to stand up to most Allied infantry in this department so no point in getting them really. Panzer Grenadiers at present are not cost-effective and occupy a niche role at best - deterring infantry flanks. Mind you, not conducting flanks themselves as they are too squishy to do so. They are not all that useful for tank busting and tend to drop schreks easily, so unless there is an emergency I would not go down that route.
Anyways, Grens are your mainline infantry. In 90 percent of all cases you will want to go for LMG upgrades...G43s increase short-mid range DPS at the cost of long range firepower, but they still won't enable your Grens to stand up to most Allied infantry in this department so no point in getting them really. Panzer Grenadiers at present are not cost-effective and occupy a niche role at best - deterring infantry flanks. Mind you, not conducting flanks themselves as they are too squishy to do so. They are not all that useful for tank busting and tend to drop schreks easily, so unless there is an emergency I would not go down that route.
12 Aug 2014, 18:41 PM
#4
Posts: 44
Are you the Biosparks of CoH1 fame?
Yes.
So in essence, T2 is used for what? A fast tech AC? Other than that I can only see a long T1 opening and getting a P4 then back tech for the Pak for more sustained AT.
12 Aug 2014, 22:08 PM
#5
Posts: 219
I find Pgrens to be great for counter initiation, I think every german player seen riflemen or shock troopers rushing their grens, so keep the Pgrens behind or with your grens and the soviet/usf player will be in for a surprise.
Also their grenade is great, yes it does cost quite abit, but it seems to do alot of damage to units in buildings.
Also their grenade is great, yes it does cost quite abit, but it seems to do alot of damage to units in buildings.
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13 Aug 2014, 02:31 AM
#6
Posts: 127
Yes.
So in essence, T2 is used for what? A fast tech AC? Other than that I can only see a long T1 opening and getting a P4 then back tech for the Pak for more sustained AT.
For Wehrmacht, T2 = Pak40 for me. I'm not always interested in teching to T3, and instead call in a doctrinal Tiger. The 222 is also useful for infantry heavy games and snipers.
13 Aug 2014, 07:29 AM
#7
Posts: 742 | Subs: 1
Why the T2 ? (against mericans)
- You will always need a Pak or american light vehicules can really annoy you.
- AC can protect you a lot from M20, can chase the mortar halftrack and can snipe the medic vehicule. If no Captain, he can really well be a mobile and armored infantry nightmare, but stay in range of Vet1+ Riflemen, cause AT grenade can hurt it. AC offers you a really good vision at Vet2.
- Halftrack can be handy too, to reinforce you in battle and hold the line.
- You will always need a Pak or american light vehicules can really annoy you.
- AC can protect you a lot from M20, can chase the mortar halftrack and can snipe the medic vehicule. If no Captain, he can really well be a mobile and armored infantry nightmare, but stay in range of Vet1+ Riflemen, cause AT grenade can hurt it. AC offers you a really good vision at Vet2.
- Halftrack can be handy too, to reinforce you in battle and hold the line.
13 Aug 2014, 10:22 AM
#8
Posts: 122
Against Soviets, you need a 222 (fastest time is 5 minutes) against T1 starts. You can see through the fog of war to see the teching of Soviets.
PGrens are special forces "elite" infantry, they cost a lot of mp reinforcement but in good positioning can kill a lot. I'd get them during mid-late game, after you have lots of T1 units.
Grens are always the main infantry. In most games, it's best to have 4 grens by early-mid game.
And PAK40s are the best AT guns in the game. Always get them, except if you know the enemy is saving up for an ISU and not teching. You can tell by their commander loadouts and if they are stalling. You should always get a quick PAK too against USF, since they tend to rush an AAHT.
You always need to build T2 even if you dont plan on building any units, incase you're forced in a situation where you need PAKs (eg KV1/8 base rush). The build time for PAKs is not long.
PGrens are special forces "elite" infantry, they cost a lot of mp reinforcement but in good positioning can kill a lot. I'd get them during mid-late game, after you have lots of T1 units.
Grens are always the main infantry. In most games, it's best to have 4 grens by early-mid game.
And PAK40s are the best AT guns in the game. Always get them, except if you know the enemy is saving up for an ISU and not teching. You can tell by their commander loadouts and if they are stalling. You should always get a quick PAK too against USF, since they tend to rush an AAHT.
You always need to build T2 even if you dont plan on building any units, incase you're forced in a situation where you need PAKs (eg KV1/8 base rush). The build time for PAKs is not long.
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13 Aug 2014, 18:25 PM
#9
Posts: 307
T2 is for double pak + half truck.
If soviets spam shock troops, upgrade your half truck with flamethrower to prevent flanking.
Also, pgrens are decent tank busters IMO, but you always need two squads with shreks. It's 240 muni, so keep them alive and always retreat when you see to much risk/ danger. Their armor got nerfed a lot, so they drop quickly to shocks and ppsh cons.
Shreck pgrens are not really useful against US because of enourmous infantry blobs ( I usually go one or two Ostwind backed up by .... again - double pak and half truck.)
If soviets spam shock troops, upgrade your half truck with flamethrower to prevent flanking.
Also, pgrens are decent tank busters IMO, but you always need two squads with shreks. It's 240 muni, so keep them alive and always retreat when you see to much risk/ danger. Their armor got nerfed a lot, so they drop quickly to shocks and ppsh cons.
Shreck pgrens are not really useful against US because of enourmous infantry blobs ( I usually go one or two Ostwind backed up by .... again - double pak and half truck.)
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