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The Jackson and Micro Fairness

19 Jul 2014, 16:12 PM
#61
avatar of Rollo

Posts: 738

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Jul 2014, 15:18 PMCieZ


Axis still have no counter to sniper, maxim, zis with guards and shocks running around. Zis guns kill trucks super easily. Not to mention demo charges and mines, which are a nightmare to defuse as okw.


In team games you will always have one player rushing stuka which usually comes out around the 8min mark, good luck trying to protect your maxims/ZiS/snipers then. Sturms also get minesweepers like an other factions so I don't see how mines are a "nightmare" to defuse
19 Jul 2014, 17:23 PM
#62
avatar of CieZ

Posts: 1468 | Subs: 4

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Jul 2014, 16:12 PMRollo


In team games you will always have one player rushing stuka which usually comes out around the 8min mark, good luck trying to protect your maxims/ZiS/snipers then. Sturms also get minesweepers like an other factions so I don't see how mines are a "nightmare" to defuse



A single stuka won't be enough to hold off a proper double Soviet push. As for mines, other factions have engineers for significantly cheaper than sturms, and they aren't as vital to winning engagements as sturms are. So it is easier to field more than one sweeper squad and it is easier to have them scouting for mines instead of fighting. Furthermore, okw has to spend effectively more than ost does to grenade kill a demo, and has to be closer to the demo to do it. Puma can attack ground the demo but this can sometimes take a while.

So yeah, of all the factions okw has the most difficultly vs mines and demos.
19 Jul 2014, 17:32 PM
#63
avatar of Corp.Shephard

Posts: 359

Usually OKW never gets far enough to get up the FlaK truck (in an actually defensive position and not just really far back). The early support weapons and mass of infantry forces them to get either a walking stuka, a FlaK HT or a medic truck with leIGs. If the Allies then apply pressure at the right timings (those units tend to be rather risky and only profitable in the long run, short term they have a huge cost and little impact) you can often cause such economic damage that they never recover.
Even mid lategame the USF / Soviets tend to have great counters and can often quickly switch tactics. Adapting to a new situation is something the OBW / OST are not really good at.

We had some internal games (3v3 / 4v4) higher skill players to test it out and in all cases Allies won. Axis might win annihilation games easily, but the early pressure from Allies means that for a long time they are usually triple capped. At a certain point they need to take fights in which they lose squads, if the Allies know that and cause maximum wipes in such situations the higher vet is useless.


Mmm. I might have been part of one such internal 3v3 and I felt the match was exceptionally close. Had the Axis forces focused their forces on one-to-two victory points in a bid to lengthen the game I feel like they would have won in the end as they were pulling ahead as the Allies managed to grab just enough victory points to succeed.

The Allies practically have to take all three victory points and hold them for a fairly significant amount of time against competent Axis. If the axis lower the amount of territory they need to control and focus on a few victory points and a safer slower strategy I would imagine they would do quite well.

Perhaps that sort of overall strategy was employed by the Axis at some level (or maybe you're talking about completely separate games!) but I think the overall Axis metagame has room to grow in terms of where players are deployed onto the map.
20 Jul 2014, 13:41 PM
#64
avatar of sluzbenik

Posts: 879

Yeah, it's the exact same issue as in vCOH re: Allies - the less skilled players aren't confident enough in their micro to keep up the pressure, I see a lot of Maxim camping (which can work well on certain maps and give u time to get tanks out) but very poor use of conscripts, rifles, vehicles generally. But everyone and their kid brother knows how to charge with a sturmpio - this is one of the things I talk about when I talk about micro fairness.

The most hilarious thing is you'd think everyone playing would know about the US flaks, but they pub crowd certainly doesn't seem to...Or using forward ambulances, all the other basic stuff you'd think people be using by now.

I'll probably be playing all random team games today too, just because I need a break from tryharding above my CPM in 1v1 :).

20 Jul 2014, 22:08 PM
#65
avatar of Spleens88

Posts: 2

I primarily play German factions because they feel more rewarding to play. US and Soviet play, at least where I am in the ladder; involve spamming units and cheese strategies. It's more fun for me to play against this than do it.
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