CieZ's Captain Opener

Hey guys, been working on a new strat over the past few days. I wanted to find a viable strat that did not involve the M15 AA (we all know that thing is getting nerfed more soon). Additionally I wanted to capitalize on the fact that probably 95%+ of OKW players (including myself) always assume that an M15 is going to hit the field, and open with a Puma or 251 Flak. This build hard-counters the Puma opener as well as the 251 Flak opener, and is able to put a lot of mid-game MP bleed on the OKW with Paratroopers + Shermans.

General build order:
Rifle, Rifle, Rear Echelon(can be 3rd rifle instead), Ambulance, Pathfinders, Capt, AT Gun, Paratroopers/BARs (depending on CP/fuel/muni), Major, Sherman (or M8A1).

Pros:
*Completely hard counters mech HQ openers from OKW.
*Plenty of AT firepower (normally something USF lacks until Jacksons)
*Faster Sherman/M8 than a Lieut + M15 opener.
*Pathfinders/Paratroopers are awesome.

Cons:
*Not as much early brute force as an M15 - your infantry micro needs to be pretty solid.
*Weak against Ostheer - Captain doesn't give you much of anything helpful against MG42s, I would not recommend this build against Ostheer. You really need that M15 or M20 to push MGs off the map.
*Potentially weaker against healing truck openers. Capt is a great support unit, and really strong against light vehicles but simply lacks the firepower that comes with a Lieut. Furthermore his thompson spreads damage evenly over a squad (making a great combo with pathfinders) but this damage can be easily healed once the medics are out.

I've long been a proponent of fast Captain play. This looks solid. Your build seems more appropriate build for the current meta.

Do you ever mix the Stuart into your build?

Captain first builds can do quite well against the campy sides (Ostheer/OKW-Medical-Truck) too if you manage to pick up a Pack Howitzer but I will admit in 1v1s it's real dicey. Probably best to accelerate to M8A1s which are far more useful.

I've gone Stuart against Ostheer, and against healing truck openers but generally not against Pumas. The Stuart CAN do well against Pumas, but it is more risky than just grabbing an AT gun and going straight for a Sherman in my opinion.

Grabbing a stuart also relies on them not having 2-3 schrecks running around. Stuarts are super nice against Sturms/Fallshirms/Obers/Fusiliers but not very efficient against schreck'd volks.

Personally it would be great for the stuart to get a high cost canister shot style ability but that is just me.

Anyway, I like the build but I think an option to Infantry Doctrine works pretty well as an alternative to the airborne. The 3CP unlock with m1919's could help boost your existing riflemen and protect the AT guns. The mortar half track could help push out MG's if you use this build against the ostheer. Though I do really agree with the need for more elite infantry like Paras and the 50 cal as a means of fighting enemy infantry later on, I guess I'm just more of a rifleman kinda guy

Neat. I've only been able to make Corp.Shephard's T3-T4 strat work for me; the Lieutenant has always been a disappointment when I've tried T2.

What factors do you consider when deciding between "Sherman/M8A1" once your Major's on the field? The M8A1 does fine against light vehicles in a pinch, and with this build you generally have an AT gun it can run to. Is the choice dependent mainly on whether there's a Panzer IV or Panther on the field already? If so, woudn't the choice be between the Jackson and the M8A1? I guess I'm not sure where the Sherman fits into the meta right now.

3x rifles -> ambulance -> capt -> flak HT -> gg -> best strat so far for USA vs OKW

3x rifles -> ambulance -> capt -> flak HT -> gg -> best strat so far for USA vs OKW

edit - Seriously unsure. Am I missing something? Is there a Commander call in HT?

it's in Tier 2, called something like M15 a.k.a flak HT

Barton the LT unlocks the flak HT, not the Captain.

that's what i meant obviously

@Barton - this strat was meant to be an alternative to the Lt + M15. I agree that Lt + M15 is the best opener, but it also gets old doing it game after game after game. Plus everyone with some sense of balance knows that the M15 is, still, grossly overpowered and will be nerfed in the future - meaning exploring other builds now can be beneficial down the road - getting ahead of the meta so to speak.

@symbol - If the OKW player has 2-3 shrecked up Volks running around, or if they have 2 Raketens around it might be worth getting the M8A1 over the Sherman. In my experience the Sherman has more raw firepower (a lot of this comes from the mounted MG) and is really good at chasing around their elite infantry (Fallshirms/Obers). M8A1 is stronger if you need indirect fire - if they're playing very campy. Sherman HE shells are REALLY strong against garrisons, so keep that in mind as well.

CieZ, what's your opinion on grabbing nades at some point early in the game?

I've been finding the nade upgrade is more useful for dealing with MG's (smoke and flanks, the usual), but most skilled players can predict and dodge grenades

Against Ostheer they can be pretty great. You can also use smoke to "clear" a house - if you shoot the smoke inside the house the squad inside cannot see anything which can be really good on some maps.

I don't really like to get early nades vs OKW because it is rarely worth throwing a nade at a Volk squad. If they're playing double MG34, they'd probably be worth grabbing, or if they're playing Sturm heavy.

Mostly just a situational thing. I generally would rather save the early fuel/ammo for BARs or M1919 on my Paras, but there are certainly cases where they're well worth it.

I've seen some players i've fought against using a similar strat to yours, but interestingly enough they forego building a second rifleman squad and stick to getting one or two RE's after the first rifleman and floating to get two pathfinder squads ASAP.

I personally think getting a second rifleman is better than two RE's but dual pathfinder with dual bars each is pretty impressive when vetted

I've seen some players i've fought against using a similar strat to yours, but interestingly enough they forego building a second rifleman squad and stick to getting one or two RE's after the first rifleman and floating to get two pathfinder squads ASAP.

I personally think getting a second rifleman is better than two RE's but dual pathfinder with dual bars each is pretty impressive when vetted

Is this in 1v1, 2v2, or what?

Unrelated: if you add two weapons to pathfinders, doesn't that negate half their awesome range 35 DPS?

Yeah the headshot mechanic is tied to the pathfinder rifles, not the squad itself. Also BARs are best at mid and close. Not really sure why people would put BARs on them, unless I'm missing something. In team games a second pathfinder could be good but I think it'd be too fragile for a 1v1.

I've seen it in both 1v1 and 2v2 but I think I've witnessed it more in 2v2 games, at least on maps with a lot of open fields like Langreskaya.

I suppose that I've just been putting bars on them because I find that it makes them better combatants at mid and close range as the rate of fire of the BAR helps if the enemy is recklessly charging in some troops in the open. With vet, I've had a pathfinder squad that just wrecked infantry and won out against an MG a couple of times in direct combat (while in green cover of course)

I don't think that they sub out the actual 'sniper' rifles the pathfinders have though

I like a captain opener against Wehr. I get a howie and it does pretty good.


But that's with my super crazy rear echelon fighting position build, wherein rifle grenade hard counters mg42.

I arrived at pretty much this exact build myself today, with a howitzer against wehr turtle strats. The Lt and his accompanying units are all hard countered by either early Rat launchers or rushed shreks, both a common sight against OKW. For the fuel cost, I think the Lt. needs a distinct combat buff or off-table call in. Fuel is it at such a premium with the USF I just can't justify Lt. into flak HT, then twiddling your thumbs waiting for the Captain.

I arrived at pretty much this exact build myself today, with a howitzer against wehr turtle strats. The Lt and his accompanying units are all hard countered by either early Rat launchers or rushed shreks, both a common sight against OKW. For the fuel cost, I think the Lt. needs a distinct combat buff or off-table call in. Fuel is it at such a premium with the USF I just can't justify Lt. into flak HT, then twiddling your thumbs waiting for the Captain.

Normally if I go Lt + M15 AA I do not follow up with a Capt, I go straight to the Major.

However, the LT is not THAT much better than a normal rifle squad. He has a thompson (which is primarily good at close range) and comes with a single "free" BAR (60 muni). Currently the fact that the M15 is over-performing by such a large margin makes the Lt such an attractive choice. I believe that once the M15 gets balanced, the Capt will be equally as viable (he comes with 2 free Zooks - 120 muni plus not having to research them - and generally 2 zooks is enough in a 1v1). Furthermore the access to an AT gun as well as indirect fire, I think, will prove to be more useful in the long-run than access to the USF 0.50cal - which, while very strong, just isn't all that necessary vs OKW or most Ostheer players in a 1v1.

I guess what I'm trying to say, in so many words, is that (in my opinion) Lt + M15 AA is currently super strong, but somewhat all-in. If you lose the M15 quickly, you're going to be in a rough spot, while the Capt is a lot "safer" because you are not relying on one unit so heavily.

Also, for anyone wondering, this strat is definitely viable with the infantry commander - for the M1919A6. You'd just open with like 4 Rifles --> Capt. I really love the Paras late game though. Plus the ability to have BARS on Rifles while my Paras have M1919s.