Shocktroops at 1CP

G43 stomp penals in no time.
Most germas only spam grens blob and if you dont have shock troops, you have problem deal with this blob. But sometimes i have lucky satchel throw. :-)

Penals can do a fine job against g43 grens provided you use them correctly.

Btw g43s come at 2cps. By that time you should have plenty stuff on the field that can deal with them. Also if you applied enough pressure he won't be able to upgrade more than one or two squads with g43s.
1cp shocks are definitely not the one and only way to go against g43 heavy gren play.

I still disagree that shocks at 1cp is a problem. Guards are 1cp is a bit too early though.

Snipers are the super hard counter to shocks. 40mp drain per pop, yes please. The German sniper fires MUCH faster than the soviet sniper, so it's a even harder counter than Rus sniper vs PGs.

Shocks are very cost effective against non-upgraded grens, yes. But, once you have LMGs on all your grens, shocks completely lose their effectiveness.

LOL german sniper fire faster than soviet sniper. Cuz Soviet troops have 6 guys while German have only 4.

Shocks eat lmg grens for breakfast. Vet 3 or not. Unless you have 3 squads they will tear right through them while barely losing health.

I'd just like to say that these need to be moved "back" to 2 CP. After playing numerous games as German (was ranked ~500 before patch) it is apparent that they come out too early. I then played several games as soviet and I was able to win with a variety of strategies (though they all involved getting shocks out as early as possible) while not really trying that hard. And an argument saying moving them to 2 CP forces use of con spam is erroneous as the whole reason they increased starting income and reduced build time on Soviet buildings was to increase variety for openers.

Shocks eat lmg grens for breakfast. Vet 3 or not. Unless you have 3 squads they will tear right through them while barely losing health.

Lmg grens can deal with shocks to a certain extent, but it needs quite a lot of micro and attention while you can simply rightclick shocks near the target squad and see them getting shredded in no time.

Losing more and more to low rank soviet players in 2v2 now. Shock troops spam and PPSH just rape all of ost infantry. Combine that with mortars hurts bad as snipers just blown up.

Spam troops, draw massive drag box, point at ostheer troops sit back and enjoy.

Soviet is really low skill at the moment.

Just think its a real shame that we are left for so long with these glaring issues without any statement or patch to fix.

It makes people lose interest and look for other games whilst it is fixed which is a shame.

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed the lack of pro streamers on twitch at the moment, I think its a worry for the community personally.

This has been happening for a long time now. Lots of better and better players no longer streaming and playing VCOH/MOW/other games.

Anyway, happy new year from Sydney! Wish you guys all of the best.

Hubewa

Losing more and more to low rank soviet players in 2v2 now. Shock troops spam and PPSH just rape all of ost infantry. Combine that with mortars hurts bad as snipers just blown up.

Spam troops, draw massive drag box, point at ostheer troops sit back and enjoy.

Soviet is really low skill at the moment.

Just think its a real shame that we are left for so long with these glaring issues without any statement or patch to fix.

It makes people lose interest and look for other games whilst it is fixed which is a shame.

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed the lack of pro streamers on twitch at the moment, I think its a worry for the community personally.

Well I think both the lack of streamers and lack of an "official" response has a lot to do with the holidays. I don't want to try and speak for Relic as I have no clue how they handle vacation time/holiday time etc etc etc but I know that I've had tons of time off of work the past month because of Thanksgiving/Christmas/New Years and every "real" job I've had has been the same in this regard. I think it'd be reasonable to assume that a lot of the Relic staff has been enjoying time off with family/friends and they really deserve it

Btw, happy new years everyone!

Regardless of breaks and all of that, the trend has been pretty consistent.

Most of the elites in VCoH are simply not playing COH2 and haven't been playing for a long time. Out of the main ppl in the SNF this year, there probably have been only about 6-10 ppl there who were in the strong players of VCoH.

This is a trend that has been continuing for longer than the past 1 wk, it has been happening for the whole 6 months since the game came out.

Finally found a 1v1 strategy that seems to work fairly well and it involves ostruppen and MG42s. Being pidgeonholed into one strategy, however, still highlights the fact that this is an imbalance.

On a more positive note, and in regard to CieZ's post above. I think that a fix is certainly on the way and that they delay is likely due to the holidays.

Yeah maybe... but this patch came out way before xmas and to be honest within a few days the problem was apparent.

It took 24 hours for them to deal with apparently "OP" Assault grenadiers

But since then we have had to deal with the T70 issue which lasted about 2 months of pain.

Finally when that was fixed for some strange reason they decided to create the current issue with the command points.

All in all its about 8 weeks now when the game has been a bit broken.

Why mess around with CP points, no one was asking for it.

Yeah maybe... but this patch came out way before xmas and to be honest within a few days the problem was apparent.

It took 24 hours for them to deal with apparently "OP" Assault grenadiers

But since then we have had to deal with the T70 issue which lasted about 2 months of pain.

Finally when that was fixed for some strange reason they decided to create the current issue with the command points.

All in all its about 8 weeks now when the game has been a bit broken.

Why mess around with CP points, no one was asking for it.

The new CP system is superior to the old one in that there is now twice as much control over the timing on when doctrinal units, upgrades, call-ins, etc will be unlocked. The only problem is that a few units (guards, shocks, t34/85s) are coming too soon. Other than that the change to the system is great and very welcomed.

I'll give you that industry was bad, I stopped playing German for that patch because it simply wasn't worth it - even when I beat the commander I didn't have fun doing so. 1 CP Guards/Shocks are frustrating but nowhere near as unbeatable as Industry was.

Just enjoy the holidays man, I'd be shocked if the next patch doesn't address these issues that we've all been worried about. Balancing a game isn't as easy as people try to make it out to be, and (once again I don't work for Relic and am in no way trying to speak for them) coming from working directly with developers on a daily basis, there are certain QA requirements that "patches" have to go through - at least where I work. So (I'm assuming and could be blatantly wrong) I'd be surprised if Relic didn't have some sort of QA process that patches go through before they can be put onto live, so while changes may seem obvious, they still have to go through the proper channels.

Just hope there is a ladder reset soon with all the stuff that's been going on recently.

i think the last two patches and lack of fixes where on purpose to make the soviet whiners happy. there was a lack of ost support on the official forums until a couple of weeks ago. i guess ost players got sick of getting the nerf bat. i said this was going to happen 4 months ago when everyone on the official forums was pro commie and saying nerf everything ost has, buff everything the soviets have.

I'll give you that industry was bad, I stopped playing German for that patch because it simply wasn't worth it - even when I beat the commander I didn't have fun doing so. 1 CP Guards/Shocks are frustrating but nowhere near as unbeatable as Industry was.

Industry is still pretty damn good - it's just being overshadowed by 1CP Guards/Shocks at the moment, which says something.

Soviet industry has not been nerfed. It's just as OP as it always was.

Soviet industry has not been nerfed. It's just as OP as it always was.

The Soviet Industry commander received direct nerfs, and all tanks (which Industry heavily relies on in 1v1/2v2) were nerfed because of the moving scatter change. Sure the tank change (nerf) wasn't directed at Industry, and it is good for the game as a whole, but since Industry relies more on tanks than any other doctrine - it still hits Industry the worst. Also indirectly AT guns are cheaper which helps a little bit.

So yeah, Industry has been nerfed.

I do agree that it is still one of the best commanders and could probably use some more nerfs though. Just nice that T-70s don't kill every single retreating squad that they come across now.

When people are talking about the Industry nerfs, yes it has been affected by several changes but those changes have also affected everything else. The effect of those changes of course make a difference (and probably slightly more than for other commanders) but if the changes actually turned it from OP to balanced is highly debatable.

However, it definitely switched it out of the forum audiences' spotlight and thus also decreased the amount of its use. FOTM seems to be something entirely different now, at least.

However, the changes aimed directly at it (removed build time decrease) did nothing at all beyond reducing the Soviet field presence by a Engineer squad for half a minute or so. The whole change was futile in my opinion and people probably just switched the doctrine because they assumed it is now somehow worse when all it means is that they have to retreat their Engineer slightly earlier.


Anyways, I think the current 1 CP Shocks are more popular because they are a really easy unit to use in most situations (right-click near enemy, very hard to wipe the squad especially with anything available early, meaning they need very little babysitting) and their counters use a lot of resources (combined with a high risk of losing them), are hard to use (sniper, arguably flame HT), or are contained effectively by other units normally accompanied by Shocks (Conscripts Oorah and AT grenades deter/cripple FHT and Sniper, if they are running away they can't prevent the Shocks from killing everything else).

Of course this also varies by skill level but still there was really no need at all to reduce them from 2 CP (1 CP old system) to 1 CP (0.5 CP old system). The intentions behind the CP system rework were good but they should have changed the units that were actually displaying balance problems and then work from there rather than doing wide changes that barely make any sense (example: KV8 same CP as IS2?).
Just change them back already. I think their cost and combat power is actually fine. They are just coming too early, allowing them to walk over all units available at that moment.

Anyways, I think the current 1 CP Shocks are more popular because they are a really easy unit to use in most situations (right-click near enemy, very hard to wipe the squad especially with anything available early, meaning they need very little babysitting) and their counters use a lot of resources (combined with a high risk of losing them), are hard to use (sniper, arguably flame HT), or are contained effectively by other units normally accompanied by Shocks (Conscripts Oorah and AT grenades deter/cripple FHT and Sniper, if they are running away they can't prevent the Shocks from killing everything else).

Exactly. Right now, between two roughly equally skilled players the one going soviets will win except the OH player delivers a flawless game.

Funny thats exactly how i feel about Elite Forces.

But it was a pointless change. But its not as easy as all you put out there against a skilled player in 1v1. Shocks bleed is brutal