I think Ost pioneers should lose their sight bonus

Jump back to quoted post27 Feb 2022, 23:34 PMKatukov

but you see, they have grenadiers whom are good mid/long range infantry from the get go and then become exceptionally good with their upgrade, but there's only 4 of them!!!!! how would they ever be able to fight back????

Jump back to quoted post27 Feb 2022, 23:41 PMOswaldMosley

Oh nvm, you're right. I forgot that Ost infantry is so bad, you need like, 10 gren squads just to fight against one single god tier riflemen squad or else it's GGEZ

Jump back to quoted post28 Feb 2022, 01:30 AMKoRneY

everything's harder for fanboys, you're not special

Jump back to quoted post27 Feb 2022, 21:52 PMOswaldMosley

I have no idea why devs think pioneers should have an extra sight range than the other engineers in the game, but this is dumb.

Jump back to quoted post27 Feb 2022, 21:52 PMOswaldMosley

Ost already has the best HMG, the best none doctrine mortar and LMG, and strong line infantry. I don't see why they should have another strong advantage layered over this already strong faction.

It's already difficult enough to counter MG spam in the early game, the sight bonus makes it even more difficult to pull off successful flanks or can give spotting for their mortars while safe inside their own MG's firing arc when trying to counter with indirect fire. They should have the same sight as the other normal engineer units.

Jump back to quoted post28 Feb 2022, 08:59 AMVipper

Here is why:
"Pioneers
Our aim is to encourage positional play and combined arms, which the Wehrmacht faction tends to reply on more than any other faction. With an increase in sight (albeit still lower than pathfinders) we are allowing Pioneers to help spot for their HMGs and other support teams.
Sight increased from 35 to 42"

It is by design.

Actually Relic was going to give the extra sight to grenadiers and proposed pioneers instead...




Although this thread has a better title is there really a need for two threads with the same subject?

Jump back to quoted post28 Feb 2022, 14:54 PMKatukov

at the game start, UKF relies astronomically more onto positioning than wehrmacht does, but they don't get any minute 0 recon, do they?


Wehrmacht has competitive mainline infantry, extremely good support weapons (and possibly considered the best weapons of their class in the game, for their cost.) They do not really rely more on this notion of combined arms as you think, unless the wehrmacht player intentionally goes a build like support weapon spam, which isn't really rare admittedly.

Jump back to quoted post28 Feb 2022, 14:54 PMKatukov

at the game start, UKF relies astronomically more onto positioning than wehrmacht does, but they don't get any minute 0 recon, do they?

Jump back to quoted post27 Feb 2022, 21:52 PMOswaldMosley

I have no idea why devs think pioneers should have an extra sight range than the other engineers in the game, but this is dumb. Ost already has the best HMG, the best none doctrine mortar and LMG, and strong line infantry. I don't see why they should have another strong advantage layered over this already strong faction.

It's already difficult enough to counter MG spam in the early game, the sight bonus makes it even more difficult to pull off successful flanks or can give spotting for their mortars while safe inside their own MG's firing arc when trying to counter with indirect fire. They should have the same sight as the other normal engineer units.

Jump back to quoted post1 Mar 2022, 03:49 AMZeroZeroNi

Both soviet combat engineers and pioneers have extra view range. And that was given so that they can be used in the field tactically i.e. spotting. If you can't counter mg spam then your a Newb thats just a fact.

Jump back to quoted post27 Feb 2022, 21:52 PMOswaldMosley

I have no idea why devs think pioneers should have an extra sight range than the other engineers in the game, but this is dumb. Ost already has the best HMG, the best none doctrine mortar and LMG, and strong line infantry. I don't see why they should have another strong advantage layered over this already strong faction.

It's already difficult enough to counter MG spam in the early game, the sight bonus makes it even more difficult to pull off successful flanks or can give spotting for their mortars while safe inside their own MG's firing arc when trying to counter with indirect fire. They should have the same sight as the other normal engineer units.

Jump back to quoted post16 Mar 2022, 04:57 AMCODGUY

Because OST is the most babied faction on the game. They've been given so many advantages over the years that they were never intended to have.

Right now the best stock infantry units belong to OST. The LMG42 Grens with the early Panzergrens is more effective than BAR Riflemen, Bren Tommies, or Penals/7-man cons. It even beats out the Volks/Strums/Ober combo due to timing on Obers (and the lack of dual schreks).

This is hilarious when combined with the best MG in the game, T0 only 260mp. Mortar, and sniper too.

Jump back to quoted post27 Feb 2022, 21:52 PMOswaldMosley

I have no idea why devs think pioneers should have an extra sight range than the other engineers in the game, but this is dumb. Ost already has the best HMG, the best none doctrine mortar and LMG, and strong line infantry. I don't see why they should have another strong advantage layered over this already strong faction.

It's already difficult enough to counter MG spam in the early game, the sight bonus makes it even more difficult to pull off successful flanks or can give spotting for their mortars while safe inside their own MG's firing arc when trying to counter with indirect fire. They should have the same sight as the other normal engineer units.

Jump back to quoted post16 Mar 2022, 08:55 AMOKSpitfire

You make it sound like grenadiers are terminators or something. I know their LMG makes them scale pretty well in terms of damage but come on, they are a 4 man squad and even with vet they end up being way less durable than most allied infantry.