Mechanized assault Cancer

yes, but that car is very very bad. you can gun it down with your penals. its only good when you rush it in, but for that situation you have your penal AT satchel.

that car delays the OST tech way too much. when you stall it and defend your 1 fuel it has no impact and you get t70 while he has nothing

I agree, but the guy I played against wasn't that good with it and the map helped also. On Langranska, sorry if I messed up the name, the middle VP gives a good portion of middle map where mg can be setup along with bunker really early. That cutoff prevents any muni collection along with gas.

so 2cps and pgrens with clowncar is alright timing. Most elite infantry are 2cps, so It is all good. I guess you might have Pgrens before BP1, but this strat has a downside of delaying your 222. Also even if you active enough and get 2 cps before having resources for BP1, you still won't win a lot of time, but you get a very late Clowncarwith slightly early Pgrens. I know that you supposed to get that with BP1 with other commanders, but still it is not a good vehicle imo.
BTW the guy you played against could go BP1 even before he could build a that party bus

About replay:
I think you understood that 2 engies into clownlar does not work if you have no munies, no point into.
I agree with Donnie the medic timing was late. With penal build I would have an itch to build Medics when I saw that 4men almost 10% Hp squad. That's like instant +100MP into -200mp upgrade.
Also PPsH penals? Do they work? Very weird upgrade for a squad that has SVTs. maybe it synergizes great with penals passive, no clue really, but they never worked for me and I was spamming Airborne for more then a year and a half

so 2cps and pgrens with clowncar is alright timing. Most elite infantry are 2cps, so It is all good. I guess you might have Pgrens before BP1, but this strat has a downside of delaying your 222. Also even if you active enough and get 2 cps before having resources for BP1, you still won't win a lot of time, but you get a very late Clowncar with slightly early Pgrens.
BTW the guy you played against could go BP1 even before he could build a that party bus

About replay:
I think you understood that 2 engies into clownlar does not work if you have no munies, no point into.
I agree with Donnie the medic timing was late. With penal build I would have an itch to build Medics when I saw that 4men almost 10% Hp squad. That's like instant +100MP into -200mp upgrade.
Also PPsH penals? Do they work? Very weird upgrade for a squad that has SVTs. maybe it synergizes great with penals passive, no clue really, but they never worked for me and I was spamming Airborne for more then a year and a half

Thanks, I only make one and it is totally dependent on still having clown car alive. Most players don't expect it so easy wipes or wipes when chasing. SVT are better overall, but they don't wipe as well. I use airborne for LMG for long range damage so it works out well. However there is no indirect which can mess you up.

Your thinking applies to this map, in Langranska where muni and gas have same cutoff, you cannot efficiently counter it. They are not worried about scout car because you wont have a vehicle.
EDIT: Like you said he had enough to BP1 but didn't since it wasn't needed. That hoarding of resources due to no BP1 or T1 lets the player keep massive pressure going and can technically bring in a 2nd one to close game out.


Again I didn't save the better replay. In that one, which was a different opponent, he only capped enough to connect MID VP to his base so that he could build a reinforcement bunker. He made no attempt to CAP rest of map. He kept pressure on me and brought in the PG. It doesn't matter that it is LATE, what matters is no counter is available. IF I had gone T2, it would be to early for AT gun, the only way I can think of countering it is with conscript SPAM and hope retreats happen.

For the better OST players, give it a try specifically on Langranska and give your thoughts.

what you also can do is mirror the mechanized tactic: play 3-4 games as ost, try to use it and see what people do against it

Here are two reason:
"Panzergrenadiers

Panzergrenadiers are having their timing changed to allow them to gain veterancy sooner and increase diversity in Wehrmacht unit compositions before further changes are made to their performance."

What a diversity, going machine guns and engineers/osttruppen in order to spam out pgrens

And before the change PG come so late that there was little reason to build them.
.

Good riddance, we should return that again, unless wehr is fine with fighting cp1 shock troops

what you also can do is mirror the mechanized tactic: play 3-4 games as ost, try to use it and see what people do against it

I will, gonna have to play against CPU a couple times to get used OST again.

What a diversity, going machine guns and engineers/osttruppen in order to spam out pgrens

"diversity in Wehrmacht unit compositions" means different builds than just HMG +4 grens. Basically allowing PGs to be incorporated in the army composition.

Good riddance,

I doubt that many user will agree with you that PG should become obsolete.

we should return that again, unless wehr is fine with fighting cp1 shock troops

Cp1 Shock/Guards have been tried and proven to be OP.

Returning PG to T2 with no other changes will simply make PG disappear back to oblivion and will probably result to more buff on grenadiers.

Point here is that contrary to you claim there was reason behind making PG/Obers arrive earlier.

Thanks, I only make one and it is totally dependent on still having clown car alive. Most players don't expect it so easy wipes or wipes when chasing. SVT are better overall, but they don't wipe as well. I use airborne for LMG for long range damage so it works out well. However there is no indirect which can mess you up.

Your thinking applies to this map, in Langranska where muni and gas have same cutoff, you cannot efficiently counter it. They are not worried about scout car because you wont have a vehicle.
EDIT: Like you said he had enough to BP1 but didn't since it wasn't needed. That hoarding of resources due to no BP1 or T1 lets the player keep massive pressure going and can technically bring in a 2nd one to close game out.

I'd just get a zis and grind through the early phase. Once you have some elite infantry and later t70, the game should stabilize. The strat is very all-in like.
Also the doctrine with 120mm, shocks and t34-85 looks like a great counter to this, or even land-lease with thompson assguards and dshkas.

Now that I have played a couple games I still feel this commander is unbalanced.

I played 4 games, 3 vs brits which I lost and 1 vs Soviets which I won.

Two of the games vs Brits I eventually controlled both fuel points, I just don't know UKF timings, units, builds since I hate the faction.

The first match I played the enemy made Raid sections which beat my ASSGrens, however I still pushed him and had him on LOCK, the only reason I lost was that I made a medic/command bunker which chewed up my muni. I didn't know about the M45 quad since I don't play UKF which is what saved him and literally lost me the game.

2nd match I rushed cutoff, fought back and forth, he made mortar which is doctrinal. I controlled Gas 90 percent of the game, made Ostwind-werfer-tiger-panther. I just don't know how to beat emplacements. Maybe back teching to Mortar would have worked. he literally rushed as hard as he could to make it. Pretty much I felt if I had any recent experience with OST I would have won. All due to the commander opening.

EDIT:Thinking it over going for Brum instead of panther and werfer would have been better and switched the game in my favor due to the bunker busting ability.

Against soviets it was hold out against penals and car until my car came out. He had decent gas but I rushed him with 2 clowncars which probably led to to much bleed which meant GG. Funny enough, we kept avoiding each other so I teched up to get that CP2 since it was taking so long.