Commander Update Beta 2021 - USF Feedback

Should it? I don't think it would be that bad to have 76mm and E8 identical and have E8 be a more expensive, better armored and faster tank.

I guess it's debatable. I mean Easy8 as a slightly different 76MM would work fine but personally I feel like it's more interesting and fun to play with distinct units and not "this unit has 10 better penetration, has more health and fires .5 seconds slower but is otherwise exactly the same". (Obviously not exact stats but you get more point). Thats why I brought up Veterency - Easy 8 has exact same veterancy as M4A3 (Barring the Vet 1 Change). 76MM is slightly different with frontloaded reload % at Vet 2 and bonus Penetration at Vet 3. If Easy 8 is going to be kind of same-y then I think you could at least tweak Vet to emphasize it's relative strengths to M4A3 and 76MM so that while Vet 0 76MM and E8 may feel similar that you actually notice a difference at Vet 2 and 3.

Problem is this is basically the 76MM Sherman and the problem has always been being able to differentiate the flavors of Sherman. If 76MM is the "able to swap to better AT generalist" then E8 should probably be a bit different.

As Etheral Dragon said:

- 76mm: 640hp, more spammable, 40 range with both shells
- E8: 720hp, more expensive, 45-50 range with AT shells, more accurate with AT shells

You could futher put them apart with Vet to define them: Flank Speed for 76mm and HVAP ability for E8 vs heavy tanks. AI shell could be the same.

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I seriously doubt Rifles ever get smoke again. Its just way too good on short range mainlines.

Infantry would probably still be fair, but it would definitely start to look a lot like Urban Assault.

I'll probably drop the idea of removing the smoke for an LeFH killing ability. It seems to have been universally panned.

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I'll probably back off removing the Smoke from Heavy Cav in exchange for a LeFH killing ability. Its definitely meeting strong resistance.

For the most part I feel like fast cap and vehicle capping abilities are the weakest doctrinal abilities in the game. They are situational, add little to no combat power, and feel expensive for what they do. Raid Tactics may be good late game to cap, but its in a doc absolutely drowning in munition sinks.

Personally, I've never loved Mechanized. Docs that do nothing but add a bunch of units are a really boring design imo. I dunno how you could do a redesign though. The doc is holding onto a lot of units that otherwise have no place to go. While the WC-51 is getting a little more strength, its late game is getting hit pretty hard with the 76 nerfs and Combined Arms adjustments.

As Etheral Dragon said:

- 76mm: 640hp, more spammable, 40 range with both shells
- E8: 720hp, more expensive, 45-50 range with AT shells, more accurate with AT shells

You could futher put them apart with Vet to define them: Flank Speed for 76mm and HVAP ability for E8 vs heavy tanks. AI shell could be the same.

Stock 45+ range might be a nonstarter as I think team doesn’t want it to roflstomp mediums more than-it does now. Vet 2 +5 range might be interesting . More reliable than the kinda clunky gunnery ability but not too good out of the box

This Seriously Dozer blade must be preserved at Mechanized Company.
Don't Delete Reserve armor. Leave it as same as now. I'm now tired to explain......

I really like the latest update for the E8. I think its a step in the right direction. It gives the E8 a much better fighting chance against heavy armour.

I'm hoping this isn't a mode that will be be required to be on 24/7.

Can Armor company receive some love.

What about 6 man Riflemn for Rifle company. Their weapon damage is only 8 so 6*8 still cant instakill a model.

What about 6 man Riflemn for Rifle company. Their weapon damage is only 8 so 6*8 still cant instakill a model.

This would only work if they get an ad hoc upgrade

This would only work if they get an ad hoc upgrade

Meaning???

Meaning???

You can't give them bars anymore

You can't give them bars anymore

Why. There are already para's with 6 men. Why would 6 men rifles 2x bar at around 200 muni be a problem.

Why. There are already para's with 6 men. Why would 6 men rifles 2x bar at around 200 muni be a problem.

Because Paras bleed, have an higher RA than Riflemen and are expensive.

Please don't make Rangers super riflemen, thats just boring and M1 Carbines are iconic! Couldnt they just get better dmg stats on them?

Because Paras bleed, have an higher RA than Riflemen and are expensive.

Yeah, 6 men rifles are less powerful and thus will cost less and bleed less.

M1 Carbines are iconic!

They have carbine in game for a long time but irl M1 carbine is far from iconic with ranger. Furthermore giving a carbine better far dmg than a rifle is unrealistic.

Having the Easy 8 handle like a mini Firefly definetly feels weird. I don't think there's many reasons to use it over Sherman + Jackson honestly, especially if your doctrine has buffed up dozer blade Sherman

An alternative would be having focused gunnery turn into "target weakpoints", increase penetration and damage at the cost of a really increased ROF, so it would switch between medium/infantry mode and anti heavy mode
Target Weakpoints would deal 200 damage, so that would make it 5 shot Panthers, 6 shot Tigers and 7 shot Super Heavies

Or just remove the Gunner BS (range, agility buffs and the commander option). Increase Hp to 800, Armour to 235. Increase price. Penetration should be mediocre. Maybe buff it a tiny bit (like 2-3% more chances to penetrate).
That way E8 is a brawler that can escape Panthers, but can't really stand up to them, unless in tandem. And with Radio net and veterancy, you would get a good tank squad. One that could roam the map much more easily than the Jackson due to increased survivability/agility.

I don't understand why make it some sort of a retarded copycat of the Firefly. If there is one thing that USF does not need, it's another long range TD

Here's an idea.

Turn the E8 into a Jumbo instead.

Slower speed, more armor, same gun as live.

That would actually give the USF a meatshield capable of being a good combo with the Jackson, similar to how the Churchill-Firefly combo is for the Brits.

Gives the USF a role in team games as well and everybody is happy since the E8 will have a more distinct direction compared to the 76.

Here's an idea.

Turn the E8 into a Jumbo instead.

Slower speed, more armor, same gun as live.

That would actually give the USF a meatshield capable of being a good combo with the Jackson, similar to how the Churchill-Firefly combo is for the Brits.

Gives the USF a role in team games as well and everybody is happy since the E8 will have a more distinct direction compared to the 76.

Ltc Abrams' ez8 was basically a jumbo anyway, so that'd be rad