MG42 just useless ?

if they fix the retard mg gunners unit will be more helpful.

that the mg gunner quite often just stares blankly at the enemy while they charge him. (never mind firing the MG because Fuck that.) i think its a bug. but either way it would definitly make the mg more effective.

WiFiDi, that might be the turning rate. I noticed that there is (sometimes?) no animation for the rotating of the MG, therefore it just looks like the gunner does nothing.

What I think MGs need: Less RNG. Sometimes it performs fine, other times you can frontally assault it.
And then the Molotov, sometimes it wipes the MG in a second, but if I play Soviets (yeah, sometimes I do ) 3/4 crewmembers survive the Molotov without moving.
Everyone would be happy if the extreme cases didn't happen (surpressed in one burst/ molotoved from the front.) I think yellow cover plays a big role here too. Maybe make it so that cover gives more protection against surpression if the unit behind it stands still, and less if the unit moves. Is this possible?

Edit: @Cardboardtank: Sadly I find myself thinking that aswell. Sometimes the MG performs OK, but if the soviets get it: Game over. Its not worth the trouble and RISK (maybe fixed through my proposition?)

Yeah, build MG42s and risk that this shit is getting capped by the Soviet player. Just spend that manpower on an ammo cache and supply 2-3 grens with the LMG --> Saves you a lot of trouble.

Yeah, build MG42s and risk that this shit is getting capped by the Soviet player. Just spend that manpower on an ammo cache and supply 2-3 grens with the LMG --> Saves you a lot of trouble.

because soviets are dumb and want that "pos mg42" sooo badly?

because soviets are dumb and want that "pos mg42" sooo badly?

No because an mg42 squad with 6 men and only 4 men gren squads without oorah to counter them is a fucking pain in the ass

No because an mg42 squad with 6 men and only 4 men gren squads without oorah to counter them is a fucking pain in the ass

its a suppression tool, not a killing machine, so 4 or 6 mean doesn't change
riflegrenade has a nice range so oorah isn't that needed
yes, 6 man soviet support squads have a better survivability than 4 man german squads

but my point was actually
it can't be that bad if soviets prefer to take an mg42 instead of building a maxim
people build an mg to stop advancing infantry and mg42 does that better than maxim
and it comes out sooner
and then people wonder why soviets revert to building hopping for cover, must be because they so strong at start of the game, yeh building a munitons cache and getting LMG grens is indeed a smart move, now those are killers compared to a badly placed mg

...but my point was actually
it can't be that bad if soviets prefer to take an mg42 instead of building a maxim...

it can't be that bad if soviets prefer to take an mg42 instead of building a maxim

Not sure if you are trolling or just inexperienced.
I'll go with inexperienced for now.


Simple question (Regardless what faction you are playing):
Would you like a new HMG unit for 90 MP (OST) or 60 MP (soviet)?
-- That's a bargain if there ever was one.

Steal any support weapon if you can, destroy it if you cannot.
Just remember to do so with a squad of at least 4 men - no need to sacrifice an entire squad to gain a support weapon unless you desperately need that AT gun/MG/mortar.


Believe me: OST players will steal maxims if they can mange.
Due to smaller squad sizes this is harder to pull off (and far riskier) for the OST though. So it might seem like they are ignoring support weapons.




Also: Please look up the soviet tier and tech structure.
The ability of building your own HGMs as soviets (in a competitive game) depends primarily on your teching choice (T1 or T2).

The MG42 whiners will surely turn into screamers when they realise how good the new soviet HMG performs... =

The MG42 whiners will surely turn into screamers when they realise how good the new soviet HMG performs... =

Oh boy, the DShK is absolutely insane! It's like a maxim shooting ptrs-bullets

The MG42 whiners will surely turn into screamers when they realise how good the new soviet HMG performs... =

Yeah, I seriously don´t get this game any longer. What were they thinking? The roles are totally flipped.

The side with the historical better MGs (MG34/42) get´s the weaker ones.

The side with inferior numbers gets a doctrine which allows to spam cheap infantry (Osttruppen).

The side which excelled at tank combat from far, gets outranged by the standard Russian T4 vehicle and has to rush in the tanks in close range to actually do something. Close combat - a thing German tankers actually tried to avoid like the plague.

The side that almost didn´t have an airforce present in 1944, gets an air-doctrine.

MG 42 was buffed very slightly today, and while I didn't have experience using it, my friend said it more consistently suppresses in the first burst now.

Yeah, I seriously don´t get this game any longer. What were they thinking? The roles are totally flipped.

The side with the historical better MGs (MG34/42) get´s the weaker ones.

The side with inferior numbers gets a doctrine which allows to spam cheap infantry (Osttruppen).

The side which excelled at tank combat from far, gets outranged by the standard Russian T4 vehicle and has to rush in the tanks in close range to actually do something. Close combat - a thing German tankers actually tried to avoid like the plague.

The side that almost didn´t have an airforce present in 1944, gets an air-doctrine.

Or how Shtrafniki are armed with SVT-40 and are all around stronger, more expensive, and more durable than Conscripts. They get Satchels explosives and flamethrowers too, definately want to keep them alive. In real life though? They were cannon fodder and nothing more. They weren't infantry, they were blobs you charged into machine guns. They were the guys who wore dark coats and carried sticks, so the Germans would fire at them instead of the white-jacketed Red Army troops hiding beside them. Not to mention everyone in the Soviet Army is either an Engineer, Conscripts, Convict, Guard, or Shock Troop. What happened to the Strelki? Am I to assume they were all killed or captured in the initial invasion and that nobody volunteered to take their place?

I doubt all this was done on purpose, most of it is probably initial design vs final execution, but regardless the current design is perplexing at best.

What happened to the Strelki?

I believe Strelki are the soviet snipers =) But correct me if I am wrong

In my opinion the mg42 has now returned to a state of real viability.

Im with Gustav on this. Its really on par what what it should do now.

I believe Strelki are the soviet snipers =) But correct me if I am wrong

I was under the impression that Strelki were the generic Red Army Soldiers, the rifles and grenades?

I was under the impression that Strelki were the generic Red Army Soldiers, the rifles and grenades?

No no no, in game if you lesten the sniper team actually says strelki. Conscripts were the generic army since they were mostly green soldiers who never actually held a gun or fought a war

No no no, in game if you lesten the sniper team actually says strelki. Conscripts were the generic army since they were mostly green soldiers who never actually held a gun or fought a war

http://www.flamesofwar.com/Default.aspx?tabid=109&art_id=1862
I'm quite sure Strelkovy were the main-line infantry force of the Red Army, and they were pretty well equipped by mid-late war (1943 onwards) too- DP LMGs, PPSHs, grenades, all that. No idea why they don't feature in COH2 but that's a different matter entirely.

If I'm not wrong strelkovy could be composed of conscripts as well- conscripts just being people made to serve in the army, not a specific type of infantry squad or section.

http://www.flamesofwar.com/Default.aspx?tabid=109&art_id=1862
I'm quite sure Strelkovy were the main-line infantry force of the Red Army, and they were pretty well equipped by mid-late war (1943 onwards) too- DP LMGs, PPSHs, grenades, all that. No idea why they don't feature in COH2 but that's a different matter entirely.

If I'm not wrong strelkovy could be composed of conscripts as well- conscripts just being people made to serve in the army, not a specific type of infantry squad or section.

Well if you are right, now we know what unit they will add with the upcomming DLCs

I say replace current Penals with Strelkovy, make a different unit for Penals (maybe not the way I said, but something new, hell make a Penals doctrine, IL-2's that can do bombing runs during snowstorms or someshit).

Why isn't there a thread to vent fantasy ideas, I could use that

This thread got off topic and has been uncommented on for three months... but. Still a current topic. A 1v1 build order I use is Gren Gren MG MG Gren T2. Two MG42s is a pain to deal with. I use them in tandem, either suppressing one area with both arcs of fire, or leaving one behind the other to cover it in case it gets rushed by conscript and molotov.
There are certain weaknesses, however:
1) MG42 in a building is a nightmare. On maps like Semoskiy, even Kholodny Ferma, or Road to...something map, putting an MG42 in a building is suicide because (to my knowledge) you cannot select targets to fire at when inside the building; the cursor changes not to the normal crosshair, but to some crosshair and a strange symbol. Upon right clicking, the MG42 proceeds to exit the building. When rushed with a conscript and molotov, the MG42 can take the order to exit, but often sets up outside the front of the building and dies (the bug still hasn't been fixed, or am I not microing it properly?).
In certain maps (like Langreskaya) NOT having a squad in a building can be advantageous to the soviets, who can go building hopping to gain ground and flank MGs. It really is a lose-lose situation
2) A double sniper opening is the death of this strat. 3 Grenadier squads against two snipers does not win. Assuming there is a conscript squad (or more) and later at least one shock or guard squad, three grens may not get far. When two men die instantly, the squad is in danger of being wiped out both from the snipers' second volley and the supporting squads. Same goes for the MG42 squads; two men down in seconds forces their retreat. Having all or most of your men retreat means lost ground, lost resources, and an early or crushing loss.
3) Poor micro ruins this. If my MGs are out of position, they are easily flanked and dispatched. The long setup time provides little room for error which leads to casualties and/or lost ground.
The advantages of the strategy include...
1) Potential for control of large amounts of territory. The MG42s can cover large areas of territory and/or cutoffs when put together (middle of Langreskaya, Minsk Pocket, Kholodny Ferma).
2) Mutual Support. The MG42s can fend off one or two squads (or more if your enemy likes blobs), however, they work best when supported by at least two Gren squads (and even a sniper to add insult to injury). When in the best situation, the MG42s can cover the front or the bulk of the enemy forces while the grenadiers can cover the flanks and lob grenades into the suppressed Russian soldiers.
The MG42s, if deployed parallel to each other, can cover the outside flank of the other MG if close enough. For example, if a conscript comes out from behind a hedge and your right side MG42 is going to get molotoved, just turn your other MG to face your MG. Bullets don't count as friendly fire (i don't think) so no danger of killing your buddies.
3) AP Incendiary rounds. The AP incendiary rounds, when used correctly, can wreak havoc against enemy light and medium vehicles. A poorly microed, non-rushing scout car is toast, so is the half track. A scout car or HT with a damaged engine is equally as vulnerable. In certain situations, an MG42's ammo can be used against T3 armor. The rear of the T34 takes a lot of damage, as well as the T70. I think (THINK) that the AP rounds can pierce the front of the T70 and T34, however, a damaged engine on an armored vehicle trying to flank your position is even better toast when you can fire on the rear armor.
That being said, the SU76 and Katyusha, I'm sure, are vulnerable to the AP rounds as well; maybe even the back of the SU85. Any heavy armor is simply a quick retreat button.

Two MG42s are both robust and effective, but risky when countered effectively. One MG42 can be good with different build orders, but I prefer two in most situations.