DevM's USF without Tears

Link to you eating soap vod pls?

thx dude

Link to you eating soap vod pls?

give me your address, i'll send it straight to you

All other factions needs good starting strategy like BO and where to go cap, defend etc, USF is only one where BO doesnt really count because this faction is meant to be aggressive, it's meant to do what your opponent can't counter and not (like ostheer for example) make units to counter something. that's why IMO USF doesn't care about starting BO, who cares if you go 3 rifles 3 RE, 10 RE or 5 rifles since they will always get better map control and be aggresive.

Of course it does matter what BO and capping order you go with, the fact that you have 4 rifles or 4 RE's is complitely different in terms of map control and all in potential, basically you need both, but you are complitely disregarding the fact that RE's are not good combat units until they have BARs and even then they are not nearly as useful as a rifle with grenades upgraded or any other kind of upgrade on them which means if your opponent wants he can go for you cut offs without many problems and believe me when I say that USF is the one that needs more fuel in the ostheer match up.

Since the gren nerf (after ninja buff Kappa) the ostheer is utterly trash, you may say im wrong but what can ostheer do, or what you do? gren spam and then 2 snipers because that's only viable counter to rifles, then you get ofc only choice, call-in Tiger cuz teching T4 doesnt give you a good tank vs everything.

Ostheer is never going to be utterly trash against USF for the simple fact that they have a unit that USF don't which is a sniper (quite an important unit might I add), this statement reminds of the league of legends forums where if a nerf comes in the champion is immediately called trash but magically makes a reapperance some time later because people find out the nerf wasn't actually that bad, sure grens got nerfed but that was warrented since USF is going to use rifles all game and grens have less reinforcing cost its just fair that the rifles need to be stronger (its mostly a design issue with ostheer that I have talked about in my interview but grens shouldnt compare to rifles). What you can do as ostheer is play around the fact you have access to an early MG and a sniper, which will boil down to which map you are playing since MGs are more or less effective on some maps. Note: t3 is very useful as ostheer.

OKW also can't beat USF in early, they also stay in one spot with med truck with few points and try to do something while USF overwhelm them with resources income, map control.

OKW is badly designed overall, they can beat USF but they rely on doctrinal units to do it which isn't great, as OKW you have access to the volksgrenadiers which are a cheap unit and can maintain decent map control.

Well, all axis factions depends on early infantry warfare, positioning and defending, they don't have early inf wrecker like T-70/M20/AA HT so all depends on early BO

That would depend, I like to use the doctrine with the puma to have a counter to those, all factions are reliable on infantry warfare not sure why you are pointing axis factions as the only one, sure people right now in this meta prefer to rush vehicels but that doesn't mean that infantry play is less or more important in that faction, its just the fact that both USF and soviets are better off rushing an early vehicel (pretty much like when in vcoh you rushed m8, it doesn't mean your rifle play wasnt important) so Im not sure where you are coming out of here.

What you describe in your strat guide is what actually 95% people do, so you didn't discover anything

I didn't say I discovered anything anywhere in the guide I think so please stop trying to state things I haven't said .

All other factions needs good starting strategy like BO and where to go cap, defend etc, USF is only one where BO doesnt really count because this faction is meant to be aggressive, it's meant to do what your opponent can't counter and not (like ostheer for example) make units to counter something. that's why IMO USF doesn't care about starting BO, who cares if you go 3 rifles 3 RE, 10 RE or 5 rifles since they will always get better map control and be aggresive.

Since the gren nerf (after ninja buff Kappa) the ostheer is utterly trash, you may say im wrong but what can ostheer do, or what you do? gren spam and then 2 snipers because that's only viable counter to rifles, then you get ofc only choice, call-in Tiger cuz teching T4 doesnt give you a good tank vs everything.

OKW also can't beat USF in early, they also stay in one spot with med truck with few points and try to do something while USF overwhelm them with resources income, map control.

Well, all axis factions depends on early infantry warfare, positioning and defending, they don't have early inf wrecker like T-70/M20/AA HT so all depends on early BO

What you describe in your strat guide is what actually 95% people do, so you didn't discover anything



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One of the best USF Commanders! I have used it in 95% of my games, mostly because it encourages more aggressive play.

Grenadier spam is honestly more annoying to counter than the Sniper

If you think that you do not have enough units to pull off a big offensive, or that it may be a risky move, then consider harassing points with smoke and avoid fighting. This will ensure that your opponent feels pressured

since USF is outclassed in every form of indirect fire

Split your units and do not blob!

the Bulldozer Sherman, which is a good mobile Anti infantry vehicle.

It is not enough to just believe in the USF; a good player must be able to exert an unparalleled amount of pressure on their opponent and at the same time, know when to do it.

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Well written guide overall, but I disagree on certain aspects of it.

Of course it does matter what BO and capping order you go with, the fact that you have 4 rifles or 4 RE's is complitely different in terms of map control and all in potential, basically you need both, but you are complitely disregarding the fact that RE's are not good combat units until they have BARs and even then they are not nearly as useful as a rifle with grenades upgraded or any other kind of upgrade on them which means if your opponent wants he can go for you cut offs without many problems and believe me when I say that USF is the one that needs more fuel in the ostheer match up.

Ostheer is never going to be utterly trash against USF for the simple fact that they have a unit that USF don't which is a sniper (quite an important unit might I add), this statement reminds of the league of legends forums where if a nerf comes in the champion is immediately called trash but magically makes a reapperance some time later because people find out the nerf wasn't actually that bad, sure grens got nerfed but that was warrented since USF is going to use rifles all game and grens have less reinforcing cost its just fair that the rifles need to be stronger (its mostly a design issue with ostheer that I have talked about in my interview but grens shouldnt compare to rifles). What you can do as ostheer is play around the fact you have access to an early MG and a sniper, which will boil down to which map you are playing since MGs are more or less effective on some maps. Note: t3 is very useful as ostheer.

OKW is badly designed overall, they can beat USF but they rely on doctrinal units to do it which isn't great, as OKW you have access to the volksgrenadiers which are a cheap unit and can maintain decent map control.

That would depend, I like to use the doctrine with the puma to have a counter to those, all factions are reliable on infantry warfare not sure why you are pointing axis factions as the only one, sure people right now in this meta prefer to rush vehicels but that doesn't mean that infantry play is less or more important in that faction, its just the fact that both USF and soviets are better off rushing an early vehicel (pretty much like when in vcoh you rushed m8, it doesn't mean your rifle play wasnt important) so Im not sure where you are coming out of here.



I didn't say I discovered anything anywhere in the guide I think so please stop trying to state things I haven't said .

BO for USF doesnt count as much as for ostheer and OKW, these factions need to decide which unit will be useful right now, well, if ostheer goes for gren spam and USF M20 so it's obvious that M20 will not only bleed on MP but on munis, most important resource for them (much more than fuel in early), they can't counter it so early, they must tech, spend MP and time to get those things up, and still it's not perfect counter (M20 crew got zook for 222 and veh itself smoke -> ostheer needs doc with smoke, and it's even more expensive i think), note that USF doesnt have to build tiers, and they get free BAR/zooks unit when teching which is rewarding too much (yea USF teching actually rewards), best option for ostheer is by going like 1-2 snipers but then USF must be retarded to not counter it with hmm... lets say M20 rush? or later on rifle BAR blob? so snipers are only useful in hard defense, even in base on some maps, they can bleed on MP but can't promise better map control

you say that Grens costs less to reinforce? ain't grens 30 MP while rifles like 28? also you think that MG is any good? one good flank and it's done, killed or retreat, IMO ostheer MG is worst of its kind, doesnt suppress much (compare Dshka or vickers, they seem to insta pin things)

you get Puma only to counter enemy vehs, maybe some early med tanks, sure, but it's still a doctrine unit, how many doctrines you know with early access to anti-tank vehicles, none, you are forced to pick a doctrine with puma to counter enemy early non doctrinal vehicle while they can choose which OP heavy tank to get later on, i also used Puma doctrine a lot, but when they get heavy stuff, IS-2 or so, they are useless then and you are left with no late game stuff

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Great guide! Really useful for scrub like me haha.

How do you deal with mg's in buildings? Just avoid them?

How do you play on faymonville approach south side? If ost player rushes mg into middle house you cant go mid because you get suppressed and the grens camp on the green cover walls by your base. But you are forced to go mid because thats where the cut off is so you cant cap left side. Only thing I could think of is rush RE into the middle house.

DEVM thanks for this guide and all the answers to the questions made by community members.

Barton u got to understand that this guide will help hundred guys that are mediocre in their play style to perform better.

BO for USF doesnt count as much as for ostheer and OKW, these factions need to decide which unit will be useful right now, well, if ostheer goes for gren spam and USF M20 so it's obvious that M20 will not only bleed on MP but on munis, most important resource for them (much more than fuel in early), they can't counter it so early, they must tech, spend MP and time to get those things up, and still it's not perfect counter (M20 crew got zook for 222 and veh itself smoke -> ostheer needs doc with smoke, and it's even more expensive i think), note that USF doesnt have to build tiers, and they get free BAR/zooks unit when teching which is rewarding too much (yea USF teching actually rewards), best option for ostheer is by going like 1-2 snipers but then USF must be retarded to not counter it with hmm... lets say M20 rush? or later on rifle BAR blob? so snipers are only useful in hard defense, even in base on some maps, they can bleed on MP but can't promise better map control

Ok, so first of all you said "if ostheer goes for gren spam and USF M20 .... they can't counter it so early, they must tech, spend MP and time to get those things up", so USF doesn't need to tech either to get the m20? We are talking about a unit that costs 340 manpower here, depending on the conditions of the game you can get a scout car shortly after the m20 is out which makes a unit so expensive much less effective. "and still it's not perfect counter (M20 crew got zook for 222 and veh itself smoke -> ostheer needs doc with smoke, and it's even more expensive i think)" It's not a perfect counter in the sense that it cant rush in mindlessly and take it out but if you keep it at range it gets the job done pretty well.
"note that USF doesnt have to build tiers, and they get free BAR/zooks unit when teching which is rewarding too much (yea USF teching actually rewards)" Yea they don't and so what, USF teching generally comes in first but the overall strength of those tiers is generally speaking weaker to their counter part and they are heavily relying on getting all those tiers out soon so they can have an answer to everything, while factions like ostheer in just two tiers has an answer to everything. "best option for ostheer is by going like 1-2 snipers but then USF must be retarded to not counter it with hmm... lets say M20 rush? or later on rifle BAR blob? so snipers are only useful in hard defense, even in base on some maps, they can bleed on MP but can't promise better map control" Are you kididng me? USF struggles a lot against snipers, any ostheer player will support their snipers in some way so rushing a m20 in will for sure end up in it being killed, and rifles with BARs is generally speaking one of the only two ways to counter the sniper and even then its hard to pull off against a well microed sniper, and obviously snipers generally mean less map control (you wanted a unit with no weaknesses?) but even then generally speaking because having a sniper out in the field knowing there will be no counter snipe means in many maps capping a sector will mean losing two or three men from a squad which helps in some way ostheer keeping their map control.

you say that Grens costs less to reinforce? ain't grens 30 MP while rifles like 28? also you think that MG is any good? one good flank and it's done, killed or retreat, IMO ostheer MG is worst of its kind, doesnt suppress much (compare Dshka or vickers, they seem to insta pin things)

Yea it is probably the worst of the MGs but it also comes in much earlier than the others and yes I think the MG is good, obviously you dont send it alone so even if a flank is coming its him that has to come to you and not the other way around which means free damage on the way there, also im pretty sure grens are cheaper grens are actually 30 yea thought it was the MG that had that value, either way 2 MP isn't that big of a difference.

you get Puma only to counter enemy vehs, maybe some early med tanks, sure, but it's still a doctrine unit, how many doctrines you know with early access to anti-tank vehicles, none, you are forced to pick a doctrine with puma to counter enemy early non doctrinal vehicle while they can choose which OP heavy tank to get later on, i also used Puma doctrine a lot, but when they get heavy stuff, IS-2 or so, they are useless then and you are left with no late game stuff

Yea and in vCoH tell me how many units WM had to counter the m8 that were mobile? none, was that a problem? no, why? because factions dont need to be mirrored, you don't need to pick the puma exactly, you can pretty much rely on a pak supported by grens and tech to t3 and get that counter. Oh and even if you do pick the puma doctrine you don't need a tiger to counter their mega tanks, you just tech to panthers an support them, they can hold those tanks pretty well (See my ace game against luvnest in the SCC4).

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The point of the guide is to explain how to play the faction better, you dont need a new mega strategy or good tricks to write a guide, it isn't obvious to many people.

Ok, so first of all you said "if ostheer goes for gren spam and USF M20 .... they can't counter it so early, they must tech, spend MP and time to get those things up", so USF doesn't need to tech either to get the m20? We are talking about a unit that costs 340 manpower here, depending on the conditions of the game you can get a scout car shortly after the m20 is out which makes a unit so expensive much less effective. "and still it's not perfect counter (M20 crew got zook for 222 and veh itself smoke -> ostheer needs doc with smoke, and it's even more expensive i think)" It's not a perfect counter in the sense that it cant rush in mindlessly and take it out but if you keep it at range it gets the job done pretty well.
"note that USF doesnt have to build tiers, and they get free BAR/zooks unit when teching which is rewarding too much (yea USF teching actually rewards)" Yea they don't and so what, USF teching generally comes in first but the overall strength of those tiers is generally speaking weaker to their counter part and they are heavily relying on getting all those tiers out soon so they can have an answer to everything, while factions like ostheer in just two tiers has an answer to everything. "best option for ostheer is by going like 1-2 snipers but then USF must be retarded to not counter it with hmm... lets say M20 rush? or later on rifle BAR blob? so snipers are only useful in hard defense, even in base on some maps, they can bleed on MP but can't promise better map control" Are you kididng me? USF struggles a lot against snipers, any ostheer player will support their snipers in some way so rushing a m20 in will for sure end up in it being killed, and rifles with BARs is generally speaking one of the only two ways to counter the sniper and even then its hard to pull off against a well microed sniper, and obviously snipers generally mean less map control (you wanted a unit with no weaknesses?) but even then generally speaking because having a sniper out in the field knowing there will be no counter snipe means in many maps capping a sector will mean losing two or three men from a squad which helps in some way ostheer keeping their map control.

Yea it is probably the worst of the MGs but it also comes in much earlier than the others and yes I think the MG is good, obviously you dont send it alone so even if a flank is coming its him that has to come to you and not the other way around which means free damage on the way there, also im pretty sure grens are cheaper.



Yea and in vCoH tell me how many units WM had to counter the m8 that were mobile? none, was that a problem? no, why? because factions dont need to be mirrored, you don't need to pick the puma exactly, you can pretty much rely on a pak supported by grens and tech to t3 and get that counter. Oh and even if you do pick the puma doctrine you don't need a tiger to counter their mega tanks, you just tech to panthers an support them, they can hold those tanks pretty well (See my ace game against luvnest in the SCC4).




The point of the guide is to explain how to play the faction better, you dont need a new mega strategy or good tricks to write a guide, it isn't obvious to many people.

The best way to deal with trolls is to ignore them MVGame SoonerLater /

snip

If you were responsible, Barton, you would still be on Staff.

If you were not afflicted by the green-eyed monster, Barton, people might read your stuff and take you seriously.

If you are as clever as you would have us believe, Barton, you would have written this guide ages ago and gone USF in tourneys, but you did not.

If you had integrity, Barton, you would have consumed soap by now.

In reality, Barton, your residual claim to fame here now is attention-seeking: to troll and troll and troll and troll.....and it is more than boring.

Rekt.

Thanks for the guide DevM, at least now I'll understand how I get stomped as Axis

Great guide! Really useful for scrub like me haha.

How do you deal with mg's in buildings? Just avoid them?

How do you play on faymonville approach south side? If ost player rushes mg into middle house you cant go mid because you get suppressed and the grens camp on the green cover walls by your base. But you are forced to go mid because thats where the cut off is so you cant cap left side. Only thing I could think of is rush RE into the middle house.

You mostly avoid buildings with MG's on them until you can get a proper flank on them with grenades.

Faymonville is a map where you need to make use of the sides of the map to get the center, bring 1 rifle around each flank while having a consistent force on the center (HMG with pak howitzer is usually good), then just come from the sides and push with your force that is already on the center .

Some people can't handle the tears.

You mostly avoid buildings with MG's on them until you can get a proper flank on them with grenades.

Faymonville is a map where you need to make use of the sides of the map to get the center, bring 1 rifle around each flank while having a consistent force on the center (HMG with pak howitzer is usually good), then just come from the sides and push with your force that is already on the center .

Ok thanks! Will definitely remember to use that strategy next time I play usf on fayonville / /

In reality, Barton, your residual claim to fame here now is attention-seeking: to troll and troll and troll and troll.....and it is more than boring.

Great Guide DevM, Christmas is early this year

If you were responsible, Barton, you would still be on Staff.

If you were not afflicted by the green-eyed monster, Barton, people might read your stuff and take you seriously.

If you are as clever as you would have us believe, Barton, you would have written this guide ages ago and gone USF in tourneys, but you did not.

If you had integrity, Barton, you would have consumed soap by now.

In reality, Barton, your residual claim to fame here now is attention-seeking: to troll and troll and troll and troll.....and it is more than boring.

well said nazi mod, i'm very impressed

well said nazi mod, i'm very impressed

He's right on most of that you know

like what?

Will people please stop posing like a bad ass if you look like a geek. makes me cringe so hard and i want to leave the community.

PS I AM FAT AND UGLY