Profile of stormycloud

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Thread: More options in game search menu please.29 Sep 2014, 21:46 PM I had an idea which would both a) empower the user to modulate the user participation experience b) bring together players with similar outlooks on game challenge c) highlight inequalities between factions d) spread the current axis 90% allies 10% search anomaly. The idea is simply this. Just as each team can veto a selection of maps they feel are not balanced ( e.g allies getting stiffed on Rostrov) the team can veto ONE faction that they would not want to play. Waiting times would be increased a little at first, but as players of an overpowered faction find themselves waiting for extended periods they will be more likely to branch out and play other factions - evening out the current German bias (in terms of players waiting) and bringing times back down to normal. It would also mean a player could come for a game of coh2 and know that there will be a fair balance between him and his opponent. Or join a match knowing a particular "flavour" of game would be awaiting. You could have Wehrmacht, vs soviets only games, or USA vs OKW - rather then the mishmash we get at the moment. Of course the option for a mixed game search would still be available to the player at any point. In: Lobby
Thread: Simple answer as to whether a unit is OP or not.29 Sep 2014, 21:25 PM Jump back to quoted post29 Sep 2014, 13:48 PMMadeMan I'm of the school of thought that there is no such thing as an 'OP Unit' in strategy games. A unit cannot be unbalanced, only a faction can be unbalanced (Credit to Sandy (?) from Ensemble Studios circa AoEIII). Because of this, I think the this topic is flawed. You can change units to better balance a faction, but I don't think that any single unit can be considered 'OP' in a vacuum the way it's been suggested. Sure you can. A simple example: Give the kubelwagon to the usa - Its OP. Give the kubelwagon to the soviets - Its OP. Give the kubelwagon to the wermacht - Its OP. Give the kuelwagon to the OKW - Its OP. The factor of note here is not the faction the kubelwagon is in, but is the unit itself. If the use of the kubelwagon offends, then pretend a unit is introduced called BIG THING 2000 which would be OP whatever the faction. Certainly considering the unit in the context of the faction it is produced by is wise, and the synergy of the forces around it may promote some seemingly innocuous unit to overpowerd. But there are some units that would pass the OP test whatever faction they would be used with. The old soviet 120mm 'god' mortar was OP whatever faction might have had it. Similarly the (pre hotfix) boosted Katushka would be OP whatever faction it was on (and to the same extent the Kat was OP then, the walking stuka is now). There is a long list of these units which eventually get nerfed. Many factors were considered, but the common denominator was that the faction who owned it would have hated the enemy factions to have it. Which was the point of my OP and one that seems self evident to the impassionate reader without an agenda. In: COH2 Gameplay
Thread: Simple answer as to whether a unit is OP or not.29 Sep 2014, 03:25 AM Hmm to try this a different way then. Two simple examples. Would Soviet players care if tomorrow there was a patch which gave the OKW players access to the T70? Some may care a little, most would not give a hoot. Would OKW players care if tomorrow the Walking Stuka was accessible to the soviets? All would vent their spleens. One unit, no one cares. Why? Underpowered. One unit, everyone cares. Why? Overpowered. My contention again is that, as a rule of thumb, the more you don't want the enemy to have a unit, the more overpowered you know it is. In: COH2 Gameplay
Thread: Simple answer as to whether a unit is OP or not.29 Sep 2014, 02:19 AM Jump back to quoted post29 Sep 2014, 01:23 AMKallipolan Well, its not really as simple as 'swapping' since this suggests some sort of direct equivalence in role that doesn't exist in many cases. Anyway, here's a list of some Soviet units that would make OKW a lot better: Sniper team, Mortar (especially 120mm), Guards (for the button, imagine this comboed with Volks), T34 (a medium tank), ISU-152, KV-8... and probably a few more, since this list only took be about 30 secs I believe any approach based on comparing single units is of very limited use, since you have to factor in overall faction design and potential combinations. It is true, as you say, that the "direct equivalent [between unit types] does not exist in many cases". If this is true, however, concurrent to this is that the direct equivalent DOES exist in the other cases. All of which, the soviet player would be more then happy to swap the directly equivalent item. Your list of units include some good units, but none of them would massively dent the soviet player if they were swapped. Most soviet players would be pretty ambivalent if the unit was swapped out for the nearest OKW/German equivalent (where applicable). In comparison, the kubel, the walking stuka, shreks, and the flak building in particular would be gleefully accepted by the soviet - and the OKW player would be vehemently against the loss. And it is the degree of vehemence that the player feels which is the indicator that should make the player think: " why do I not want the enemy to have this particular unit X so much when I am ambivalent if they were to have another unit Y?" The answer to that is fairly obvious, they know its overpowered! In: COH2 Gameplay
Thread: Simple answer as to whether a unit is OP or not.28 Sep 2014, 22:29 PM Jump back to quoted post28 Sep 2014, 19:41 PMKallipolan The approach you are describing is incredibly flawed because factions have different basic designs with different strengths and weaknesses, and a unit that plugs a gap in a faction might make that faction OP even if the unit itself is fine. For example, OKW have Panzershrecks on their basic troops to provide AT. To partially compensate for this, their actual AT gun (the Raketenwerfer) is much weaker and shorter range than other AT guns. Given that they already have Panzerschrecks, it would be unbalanced for OKW to have an AT gun as good as the Pak. Does this mean that the Pak is overpowered. No. Well the Raketenwerfer 'weakness' in comparison to the PAK is already taken into account by being a lot cheaper then the Pak, not to mention it can garrison buildings and retreat(so you are having your cake and eating it there) but I do take your point that units should be partly judged in the context of the army they are produced by. This still, however, does not counter the point that the OKW have a list of units of which the soviets would give their right arm for. And the soviets have arguably nothing at all the OKW would really want. A simple swap of same role units/weapons demonstrates this. Ask a soviet if he/she would swap doctrine PTRS for Schrecks? Swap Kats for Stukas? Swap scout cars for kubels. Swap t70 for luch. Swap anything for Su76. All will be met with a resounding "yes". The reverse is not true. The OKW player would not be happy with the swap. And this is an underlying symptom of the diagnosis that those units are over powerd (or alternativly their alternatives are underpowerd). Other symptoms include the 80-20% search rates in multiplayer and the recently released figures showing the german dominance of the win rates. Note that this is not a OKW are overpowered thread, back in the early days of "God" mortar call ins for the soviets, the german player would have loved to have had a god mortar and the soviet player would not have wanted to let the german have it. Hence I would have argued the item was overpowered, and indeed it has taken several nerfs, and its not particularly hotly debated anymore. In: COH2 Gameplay
Thread: Simple answer as to whether a unit is OP or not.28 Sep 2014, 18:57 PM Strikes me, that in the question "Is unit X overpowered", a good rule of thumb as to a yes or no answer is as follows. "Would you care if the enemy had access to that unit" As an example, ask a soviet player: " Would you mind if the enemy had access to a forward HQ? The answer would generally be "yes i would mind". From this, perhaps we could conclude that the forward HQ is overpowered. Conversely, if the same player was asked: "Would you care if the Germans had the t70 light tank available to them"? The answer of course, would generally be "absolutely not, feel free to take it ". In fact the answer would actually probably be more likely to be "whats is a t70-light tank?" they are so underused - and the total lack of care at the enemy having access to a unit is a further useful indicator of when a unit is underpowered. Some questions would produce no majorly strong opinions. Would you swap pioneers for engineers? Grenadiers for conscripts? Zis for Pak? You might have a preference, but you would not consider it gamebreaking, and we could therefore conclude that here we have balance. Continuing this theme then, the questions is what units do the soviets actually have that they would have any level of care if the germans got them? The oft quoted "maxim spam" complaint from german players is easily addressed by saying "ok we will swap them for mg42s". I wager most soviet players would love to swap them. Perhaps shock troops? The OKW have plenty of superior troops - even sturm pios can knock a dent in shocks. I struggle to think of any unit (baring the hq ability) which I would give a hoot about if the germans had them. Perhaps the engineers mines? The precision stike ability on mortars maybe? Can any soviet player think of any? Can any german player think of any they would really like? Looking now at the German arsenal. I would bite the hand off (in decreasing degrees) anyone offering me the kubelwagon, the walking stukka, decent infantry anti-tank, the okw flack building, decent 'behind the line' troops (LOL partisans), the KT, the Jag. There is a long list of units. TLDR Ask yourself the question next time you claim a unit is balanced. would i mind the enemy having them. If the answer is yes, consider why you think it is balanced. In: COH2 Gameplay
Thread: Starting side for each nationality now fixed?27 Sep 2014, 17:58 PM Any chance you can fix this RELIC, removing 50% of the map options seems a bit silly. In: Lobby
Thread: Stole a Kubelwagon27 Sep 2014, 17:57 PM First time i have got my hands on a kubelwagon. Enemy abandoned it, I hopped in. Things are amazing. * Blob coming from left: rapid rotated pined everything. * Blob coming from right now as well: Reversed at 100mph 2 inches down the road, rotated, set up again, pinned everything * Saw a rakenwerfer setting up at maximum sight range - i had reversed before it got a shot off. Reversed slightly to the side of a building and set up again covering the road It has enough HP so that you can take a hit or six and reverse back for repps. Blobs that were walking through the maxims laughing hit the deck when they came into the kuble MG. It stayed alive all game until getting hit by the other "dubious" OKW unit; got it in the face from a walking stukka. Amazing unit. In: Lobby
Thread: Should the blitzkrieg ability cost fuel? 19 Sep 2014, 19:18 PM I think it should be that you should Blitzkrieg INTO battle (flanking, getting behind lines) not use it to run. Should not work if tank has over 50% damage. In: COH2 Balance
Thread: Starting side for each nationality now fixed?19 Sep 2014, 16:54 PM 2 Further South in Lienne Forests South east in steppes Thanks for input, yes it does appear to be broken then. In: Lobby