soviet tech suggestions

Funnily enough, I do recall you being the first to drag the pro player argument out in a different topic when confronted.

As such, I think the lady doth protest too much.

But I do agree, "pro" players can have a kind of tunnel vision of their own. Many people who consider themselves expert players can get caught in thinking that certain mechanics or balance decisions are balanced. When the reality, they only work via extreme micro/macro at their level of play, and doesn't work for almost everyone.

But back on topic.

I really disagree about making Soviet teching more like Germans, where you have HQ purchased levels.

But I do think global fuel based upgrades are interesting and are somewhat Soviet. Those upgrades are very tricky to balance though. However, if tied to certain tech buildings it could make for more interesting choices overall with Soviet teching.

B1 could have a costly upgrade to upgrade conscripts to the heavier AT grenade, for example.

Funnily enough, I do recall you being the first to drag the pro player argument out in a different topic when confronted.

As such, I think the lady doth protest too much.

No, I have not.

Wrong again. And unless you can evidence your false claim with a quote, or altleast some more contextual evidence to indicate where younclaim that has happened, you are basically lying and guilty of libel.

I actually like the tech of soviets vs germans.

I just feel soviets need a SMALL, SMALL, SMALL bounus to Anti-tank capabilities during the T2.5-3.5 game-area.

I would be thinking along the lines of giving penals PTRS upgrade to get either 2-4 rifles. OR giving Guards rifle ANOTHER additional x2 PTRS upgrade, to have a total of 4, and not be able to get DP rifles.

Obviously, buffing guards is kinda hard to do as 2v2+ games will make "massing guards" even better.

Or make a new commander/doctrine that makes Partisan units available in muliplayer where they are a 4 man squads that can be upgraded to either anti-inf (DPs) or anti tank(PTRS) and 2-4 men get those guns. I would like to say 0CP but, giving soviets a 0CP unit will make their early game EVEN MORE powerful. Maybe you can make a crappy balance idea, like DOW2 -Imperial Guard- Sentinals, and have partisan troops ONLY DECAP

Thing is, Soviets don't have tiers so much as a building tree. Very rarely will Soviets tech back due to the time and resources it takes.

Germans have more solid tiers.

They need more AT options in Building 1, so that Building 1 and 3 becomes more viable. As it stands, if you plan to go Building 3 for T-34s, then you need Building 2 for the zis-3.

No, I have not.

Wrong again. And unless you can evidence your false claim with a quote, or altleast some more contextual evidence to indicate where younclaim that has happened, you are basically lying and guilty of libel.

Are you a college student in a "pre-law" major like philosophy? Or perhaps a first year law student taking torts and evidence?

As a practicing attorney, I don't think you using "guilty of libel" correctly.

Btw, using legal terms outside of an actual legal brief is something real attorneys actively avoid. A lawyer's job is to effectively communicate with a target audience, and not confuse them with legal jargon.

Nullist likes to bandy around a lot of words and concepts he doesn't quite understand.

The post is there to find by searching through your history. I don't have the time to dig through your crazy posts for one more crazy thing you've said, and you've about burned up any good will built up for you with your recent posts on ignorance. So, make yourself less ignorant and go look it up yourself.

he think's he's bloody smart with his big words and shit, its pretty funny

Thing is, Nullist often has good points, but often fails to recognize a proper rebuttal, doing the annoying thing of repeating the same thing over and over.

I'm guilty of as much name calling as him and using big words. So whatever.

Claiming in writing that I have said, done or written things that I have not, is lying and libel.

I elaborated my positions on key balance issues above and there is nothing there that warrants these accusations. They are sound and fine.

All this ad hominem and generalised bullshit is just flat out unadulterated bad trolling, and false.

To return to topic, my position on it is in post nr.3 of this thread. If you can find bias in that, feel free to point it out. Or if you want to discuss my position there, go ahead. Otherwise, this ad homenim is getting none of us anywhere fast.

Invisibled a load of stuff. Play nice and keep personal grudges / slapfights out of the thread guys.

i think a little more should be removed, this post turned from a "let's talk about new tech suggestions" too "let's hate nullist" post

i think a little more should be removed, this post turned from a "let's talk about new tech suggestions" too "let's hate nullist" post

This, keyboard warriors just expose their stupidity at times and just derail threads just because of unnecessary hatred to each other, aggressiveness and conformity.

Anyways only Tier 1 simply needs to be cheaper. It is significantly much worse than its counter part (t2).

Tier 1 is simply much worse, it doesn't even depend on situation anymore. Penals are too manpower draining, which I hope get a slight price decrease since they are actually decent(they can beat grens very easily) Nullist posted some stats on another thread. But currently there is really no point to obtaining penals especially since elite infantry from Soviet's doctrine are usually present.

Snipers are the only good units to build from tier 1.

Clown Car is simply not useless however, too risky to use now. Germans can grab scout cars quickly now which is much more superior even without the cannon upgrade due to it's health. (But its 5 more fuel so I guess it can make up for it). Also M3s significantly slows down teching for soviets which is fine.

I've been saying this from alpha but I wished they scrapped the scout car and clown car concepts overall and make them as Reconnaissance vehicles. Make the german Scout car T1 ( no cannon upgrade and weaken machine gun and health) and make the mortors tier 2. This can allow strats in which the German player can make a gren squad with support with a scout car similarly to the motorcycle. Same thing with the clown car and disallow passengers going inside. This was an idea during the alpha days, it probably wont work now obviously.


Going back to topic, I also feel like T3 is much more inferior to T4 as well. I really have no problem countering German tanks unlike most Soviet players for some reason but their counters to them are seriously redundant and gets boring. Germans have much more options for core base At: shrecks, paks, stugs, PZ4, Panther .

While Soviets core base At is: at guns which only hurt medium tanks, t34, su-76 which is useless and the infamous Su85. These low amount of options are effective but it makes them boring and predictable. T3 needs a price drop but if it does receive one then t70 rush will arrive way too early and could ruin the game overall. This is why the teching balance is going to bad either way unless a radical change is implemented which relic are most likely noting going to do.


What I would like is for the Soviets to have doctirnal At infantry, sort of like American's Rangers not useless ptrs. This will create new strategies for both sides since if germans spam AP round tanks such as panthers they will be screwed unless they have anti infantry support.

This made games much more interesting in vcoh, if a player used airborne or rangers then the german player would make knights cross holders, grens, more support weapons etc. If they add Anti tank infantry for soviets as a doctrine, then they should add elite anti-infantry such as fallschimjager.


TLDR: Reduce price of T1, but maintain price with t3 so t70 rushes won't be broken. Soviet options aren't bad, their limited functions make them redundant and predictable which makes them a boring faction to play as at times. A good change for the Soviets would require a complete overhaul to the teching system which Relic won't do. So a option would be giving Soviets an Anti-tank infantry unit as a doctrine that requires 2-3cp so that way it would create more strategies on both sides. Such as Germans not spamming tanks with AP only but have AI tanks or anti-infantry on the field. If they add a (good) AT infantry for soviets, then add a good AI infantry unit for the Germans such as Fallshicmjaegers.

Also side note: The Elefant and Panther not having AI doesn't really matter due to the Soviets dont have any good AT infantry that can hurt them.


Sorry for any typos, I wrote this at late at night.

3. For RTS games, often higher IQ.

Hold there.

To get this topic back on trac, yes the OP is very correct and the soviet's "decision based" approach on teching needs to be less game deciding.

The goal here is to make tent and support kompaneya non-mutually exclusive while providing a manageable access to tanks on time (~10 mins).

I would just half* the fuel costs of buildings and let it balance out with the shit tier units the soviet gets access to. The issue may be with the timings, but since the T-70s window is too small to be useful already, and the T-34 becomes a waste of fuel 2 minutes after it pops, the remaining concern is - as usual - the SU-85...


*or some other factor