[1v1] Soviet VS OST

Started the match a tad late but I am sure I lost for a different reason.
Squad preservation is a issue I cant seem to get better at.
This map is always difficult for OST. But I can't seem to figure out what the weaknesses of Soviets are and how to break out of the little corner OST is always forced to playing in in the beginning.

Thanks,

•  
  

  0

  VS

  Seismic Squall

  [kor]Kestral

  Soviet VS OST

  by: SeismicSquall map: La Gleize Breakout

  1

  -

Hi SeismicSquall,
I really like your enthusiasm towards this site, it´s Strategist and generally a community, eager to help you, present here. After so many replays you´ve posted here you still believe in us and our methods of helping. Maybe because we have never failed you yet, when it comes to writing a good replay review. Maybe because of something different. I don´t know, but I´ll try to not fail you this time with my review. I might be strict when it comes to pointing out your mistakes, but I don´t see any option of improvement from your side if you don´t know your mistakes you´ve made in this match. So let´s begin.

MAP VETOES
The best thing you can do in the future is to ALWAYS veto this map when playing Axis factions, especially Ostheer. I don´t see any worse map than this for them, so use one veto on it

BEING AFK/LATE START
This is a serious mistake on your part. Always wait in game window while your game is loading so you do not miss anything. First seconds of the match are the most important ones. In many high-ranked games a whole match can be decided by few seconds in the beginning. Player who takes control of an important building/area will seize initiative and unless his opponent will (at least slightly) outplay him at some part of a game, he´s not re-gaining the initiative and thus he won´t make any comebacks. This is called the snowball effect. A small advantage can snowball into big one later on if both players are playing equally well.

Yea, I know, a few seconds in the beginning of a match won´t decide whole match. Much more is decided by build and capping orders, general micro and game knowledge. But still, idling in your base for 1 minute and 45 seconds will give your opponent A HUGE window of opportunity to take most important map areas. Why make your game harder when you don´t have to.

EARLY GAME BUILD ORDER
There´s no point acquiring a second pioneer so early. Simple he lacks a much needed firepower to be able win early game engagements. It´s always better to acquire another Grenadier squad early on and build second pioneer once you have enough munition to upgrade him with flamethrower (if it´s an urban map like La Gleize) or with minesweeper when you are in danger of stepping at mines/demolition charges or when you already have some vehicles and need another repairing squad so these vehicles can return back to battlefield faster.

Also there´s no point in building a fuel (or a munition) cache in a 1v1 environment. Simply put a single infantry squad (almost worth the same manpower cost as) will win you some engagements throughout the game. And the engagements will result into better map control. Map control will result into better resource income. Much better than single cache can give you. Even if that single squad only gave you an advantage in 1 strategic point, it´s still better than a cache because a strategic points gives you +3/+5 while a cache only gives +3 or +5. And I´m not even taking into account that when you gain a strategic point your enemy will lose one as well, so he will now have -3/-5 resource income.

EARLY GAME FIGHTS
You did very well in the early game when it comes to fighting. It was really good, even better if we take into account a factor that you was idle for almost 2 minutes.

One thing I would change here though. I would send a second pioneer to cap his side and harass his fuel, so he would have to divide his forces.

MID GAME BUILD ORDER
Mostly good but I would go a 222 first and then tech a Pak against Soviet player because the 222 has a shock value. And you really need a shock unit against Soviet player abusing Penals.

SQUAD PRESERVATION
Generally learning how to preserve your army isn´t easy but it should become better with time. The more you play the game, the better you get at it. I´ll try to help you here as well and give you some tips. If you knew those tips you might have lost a lesser amount of squads.

Losing a HMG42 to Penals satchel charge at 9 minute mark – Never garrison a HMG42 when Penals are close or when you do not know who is nearby the garrison. The HGM42 needs to first pack when it enters a garrison and then unpacks once you order it to ungarrison. This together takes much more time than throw and explosion of a satchel charger, resulting into a dead HMG42.

Loss of a Pioneer at 10 minute mark. This little bugger died on his retreat. He was already badly injured when you sent him from your fuel point to nearest VP point – behind enemy lines. He had no chance to survive a retreat through 2 Penal squads and a Clown car. Never go behind enemy lines with lone injured squads as they have little chance to survive.

Loss of a second HMG42 to the Clown Car at 11-12 minute mark. If you have positioned your Pak more properly, so it can reposition without problems you wouldn´t lose your HMG42 to a flanking Clown Car.




CONCLUSION

Being idle in the beginning of the match, small mistakes in your build order, squad preservation and bad map choice resulted into your defeat. If you vetoed La Gleize, this match could have had a different outcome as your opponent wasn´t better than you.

Please reply to me once you read my review.

There's nothing more depressing for me here than not know if my review was put into good use or never reached its target.

Cheers
Hector

Please reply to me once you read my review.

There's nothing more depressing for me here than not know if my review was put into good use or never reached its target.

Cheers
Hector

Thanks, Hector!
I never really did the math with caches. I just thought I could spend my float allot faster if I have 3 things building at the same time, thusly have the illusion of catching up faster.

I didn't build a 222 because ... well I still feel like its accuracy is very unstable and it does not seem to do good damage vs buildings. I did not have a good feel for where m opponent was in terms of fuel advantage. Also, I have seen many 222s waay go down too early and If they do survive into the late game they sit on the sidelines with little to no use. I just cant seem to find a reason to build one.

I have no clue how defend against early tanks. Paks get flanked and then they die, same with MGs.
Should I always have Grens beside my pak or MG? I can't just sit around and not cap with Grens, and I cant really move up MGs/paks up to where my Grens are advancing, as they can only be in a few select locations without being at risk. You saw how even when I had my pak so close to my base it was still very flankable by the clown car.

Thanks again for watching!
Sorry for the late reply. I have had less time lately to check up on update here. To be honest i did not think anyone would get to my replay.

I have no clue how defend against early tanks. Paks get flanked and then they die, same with MGs.
Should I always have Grens beside my pak or MG? I can't just sit around and not cap with Grens, and I cant really move up MGs/paks up to where my Grens are advancing, as they can only be in a few select locations without being at risk. You saw how even when I had my pak so close to my base it was still very flankable by the clown car.

On closed maps like La Gleize, mines are really powerful against veichles. Ost are especially priviliged in the mines department, because they have different mines dedicated to specific purposes.

It simply cannot be overstated how amazing the Teller mine is! First and foremost they are able to one-shot light armor and severely cripple any other armor type, making it easy to finish with paks.

Another factor is that most opponents outside the top 200 are not willing to invest in sweepers before they have encountered the first mines. The teller mines will therefore lie is hiatus and freely letting unsuspecting enemy infantry trod all over them without issue. Only when the first armor rolls over will they unleash the immediate punishment, taking away any edge the opponent was hoping for and instilling an instant shock and paranoia that will most likely stay with him though the rest of the game.

I will often delay the gren lmg upgrade in favour of a few well placed tellers, knowing that this will most likely pay off in the long run. Personally I will also not put down s-mines before the first teller mine has been triggered as I don't want the opponent getting into the mind-set of looking for boobytraps before he has paid the price in a burning wreck of his initial armor.

Thanks, Hector!
I never really did the math with caches. I just thought I could spend my float allot faster if I have 3 things building at the same time, thusly have the illusion of catching up faster.

I didn't build a 222 because ... well I still feel like its accuracy is very unstable and it does not seem to do good damage vs buildings. I did not have a good feel for where m opponent was in terms of fuel advantage. Also, I have seen many 222s waay go down too early and If they do survive into the late game they sit on the sidelines with little to no use. I just cant seem to find a reason to build one.

I have no clue how defend against early tanks. Paks get flanked and then they die, same with MGs.
Should I always have Grens beside my pak or MG? I can't just sit around and not cap with Grens, and I cant really move up MGs/paks up to where my Grens are advancing, as they can only be in a few select locations without being at risk. You saw how even when I had my pak so close to my base it was still very flankable by the clown car.

Thanks again for watching!
Sorry for the late reply. I have had less time lately to check up on update here. To be honest i did not think anyone would get to my replay.

The reason is the same as with Soviet Clown car. To have a mobile unit, that can apply pressure everywhere. It doesn´t have to be good against units in garrisons. Being able to defeat any penal squad (with a bit of micro) without bleeding a single manpower is already good enough. It also hardcounters clown car. Once you hardcounter his clowncar you can roam with your squads freely and every time a fight occurs move a 222 there as well. Grenadiers and 222 with always defeat Penals. 222 Can also protect your flanks - for example fight off a charging penals squad trying to flank your HMG/PAK.

This will result into more won fights which implies a better map presence which implies better map control which implies better income which implies a better income which implies a sooner tank. And a tank = more pressure = better map control that eventually leads into a win. It may not seem that 222 pays for itself but it does because it gives you a way to acquire more tanks sooner.

In the lategame 222 can be used to bait a t70 over a teller mine (t70 + teller = wreck) or once it receives vet 3 it can be an effective spotting unit for your paks or stugs.

If you had 222 you would not lose pak to flanking clown car thus the 222 would pay for itself.

When he starts fielding tanks you should as well. Otherwise you are on a back foot and losing. When you are losing you should build second pak so a) you can 2 shot (2*2=4) medium tanks instead of 4 shot (single pak). One pak can protect the other one and vice versa if you position them correctly. It is wise to keep your AT guns a bit behind so they are never exposed and simply move them 10 meters forward to frontline once a tank shows there. Keeping a grenadier squad near paks is a MUST if PAK ARE NEAR FRONTLINE. If you paks are behind they CAN BE LEFT UNPROTECTED. Enemy will have to breach your frontline first, giving you enough time to reverse your paks or position them correctly to destroy any incoming tanks.

Also mines, as Joshua said.

Well i didn't watch the replay but here are some general tips for playing OST in this map:


Playing against SOV:

Never get MG42s it'll get flamed out or satcheled out of good buildings.. instead get some PGs in the mid game and 2 pios in the early game for 1 flamer and 1 sweeper for demos.. you may build another one if you lose one because it is essential that you sweep out the demos/mines, if you lose the flamer pio in the late game get another sweeper so that you can sweep the map faster or if 1 of them is in the base you still have sweepers in the front.

For late game Ostwind+Stug combo is pretty nice if you setup some tellers at your flanks first. If you don't have the time/munis to do so then getting a lot of P4s is the good choice. Then Brummbars in very late game to deny the capping of VPs or capture points.

Against USF:

This is the easier match-up for you because you can get G43s with the elite troop commander and just spam grens everywhere, getting 5-6 grens should be your first priority. Microing them all should be hard at first but that's how you improve your micro, he has to go LT to counter all your inf which you'll get a Ostwind/P4 against him. If he goes Captain you'll have much easier time since you'll be able to dominate the infantry war. Whatever the case may be you'll have the win if you play equally.

Against UKF:

Now this is the hardest match-up against you. Not only do you get outmatched in the infantry war with the sections, but you get outmatched in the middle game as well with AEC and flamer sappers if the enemy goes the doctrine which he %90 would.. So you can't kill his inf with your inf and your 222s/Flame HT gets countered by AEC.. In this situation you have to stick to 1 side and try to stall for late game and that's all the tips i can give for you against the UKF


Hope these will help you out in your games to come
Earth

Also note that a vetted 222 scout car has excellent sight. It may not actually just be 'sitting on the sidelines' as it may be providing crucial LOS.

Thanks for the feedback everyone.
Much appreciated

Against UKF:

Now this is the hardest match-up against you. Not only do you get outmatched in the infantry war with the sections, but you get outmatched in the middle game as well with AEC and flamer sappers if the enemy goes the doctrine which he %90 would.. So you can't kill his inf with your inf and your 222s/Flame HT gets countered by AEC.. In this situation you have to stick to 1 side and try to stall for late game and that's all the tips i can give for you against the UKF


Hope these will help you out in your games to come
Earth

Although this does not sound like much of a strat. How will you survive till late game if he will get there first due to better map control?
I'm having serious trouble now with high ranking UKF. On open maps especially. They just spread and win engagements against my inf. If i Stick to one side they will ignore my corner, cap the rest of the map and then swarm my position.

Although this does not sound like much of a strat. How will you survive till late game if he will get there first due to better map control?
I'm having serious trouble now with high ranking UKF. On open maps especially. They just spread and win engagements against my inf. If i Stick to one side they will ignore my corner, cap the rest of the map and then swarm my position.

Sniper or double mortar is the answer. UKF cannot do a much against neither of them. Your Sniper has better cloak, vet 1 ability, aim time, better support (grens with fausts, 222 is better at hunting his Sniper than UC at hunting yours) and comes sooner. Sniper is definitely a pain in the assessment vs 4 man IS squads.

Same applies to mortars as well, UKF infantry has to be stationary to receive passive bonus. And stationary infantry is a sitting duck for mortars.

Thanks again, Hector.
I'm going to try and let my brain absorb all this. I will try to post another playback if I get the time to play this week, hopefully with applying some of these approaches.

Any general advice with someone who struggles with multitasking. If I try to focus on no more than 2 VPS at the same time - sometimes I do have a feeling that 3rd VP is unprotected and send a squad in for capping. Sometimes (rarely) this works out, and the opponent gives up the weak side to focus more on harassing my side and central points, BUT alot of the time as soon as I start splitting my forces I get attacked, sometimes in multiple areas simultaneously and end up losing control, hence suffering wipes.
So my question is: should I not get greedy? As OST, should I try to dig in and wait for the opponent to arrive? I feel if I do this I am wasting resources, by not using my units to either cap or attack.
I don't play that often and rarely the same people, ergo it is very difficult to anticipate my opponent's moves.

Thanks again, Hector.
I'm going to try and let my brain absorb all this. I will try to post another playback if I get the time to play this week, hopefully with applying some of these approaches.

Any general advice with someone who struggles with multitasking. If I try to focus on no more than 2 VPS at the same time - sometimes I do have a feeling that 3rd VP is unprotected and send a squad in for capping. Sometimes (rarely) this works out, and the opponent gives up the weak side to focus more on harassing my side and central points, BUT alot of the time as soon as I start splitting my forces I get attacked, sometimes in multiple areas simultaneously and end up losing control, hence suffering wipes.
So my question is: should I not get greedy? As OST, should I try to dig in and wait for the opponent to arrive? I feel if I do this I am wasting resources, by not using my units to either cap or attack.
I don't play that often and rarely the same people, ergo it is very difficult to anticipate my opponent's moves.

Go ahead with posting another replay, but, please, do not post your first loss you encounter.
I think you are wise enough to figure out most of your mistakes and reasons why you lost the game yourself. If you lose, first watch the replay yourself (to see what YOUR ENEMY DID, to GET A WHOLE PICTURE OF THE MATCH) and then, if you´re still hopeless or unable to figure out your mistakes yourself then go ahead and post it here.

I´m not trying to discourage you from posting replays here. But the reality is that often too many players post replays with obvious mistakes (eg I lost because I´ve lost 3 squads in the early game, what I did wrong ? ) and then sometimes strategists don´t have the time to help those who really needed.

Another factor is that if you post a replay in which you are really hopeless you will learn a lot more from the review compared to replay with obvious mistakes.

So if you lose, save your replay, name it somehow so you rember what it is, play some more games and if you lose another game save it as well and repeat this for some time - 2-3 days, max week. Then you´ll have a database of replays of games where you´ve lost. And I´m sure you´ll be able to pick 1 or 2 replays where you was stuck at most

Ostheer isn´t all agression faction like Soviets or USF. They often capture key locations, hold their side and once they force enemy to full retreat they make a full-scale assault on enemy Cut-off (for example). Then dig in there and so on and so forth. Whole Army will head to enemy most important location while 1 injured squad (and pioneers) will cap any captured land behind the new frontline

But even for OST harrassement is very good as it divides enemy´s attention, focus and allows you to decrease amound of pressure put on you. I often use Sweeper Pioneers to harrass enemy´s strategic points as
A) Pios are weak in combat and don´t help at all in a fight
B) Sweeper will find and clean any mines - you wont lose any members while harrasing + there wont be any mines slowing your frontal assault once youre ready to advance with your main force


If I get some time and be lucky to play a good game with Ostheer I´ll post it here so you can learn from it (you can ask any questions about my decissions in the game then )