Kick out 4vs4 maps

Montargis was a great COH1 map, but moving the fuel just didn't work. As others have said, generally Brits/OKW will take the fuel and it's GG. The map layout is classic, but they put the ammo on the hill for a reason: it's not as crucial, though in COH1 for Axis it was a valid tactic to leave the middle to the US MGs, snipers and Brit mortar pits and try to play for the long game with vet and munitions-based abilities.

Lorch is the one I hate the most, the city is overly biased toward Brits holding it for very long periods, same as on most urban maps. The castle side of the map is just a waste of space, almost like the designer spent so much time positioning buildings on the one side he just didn't want to do any more design on that side. In general the middle doesn't have enough flanking routes because of the garrison and walls, and makes for another stupid, annoying indirect fire stalemate.

To clear that out:

This poll is closed.

Wait for Decemberpatch

A few observations:

1. The 2v2 map contest is not using any of the urban or industrial maps that have buildings. The first tournament after the contest has three of six maps FULL of buildings. Lorch Assault and Lienne Forrest are current soviet Urban Defense instawins. Will be interesting to test these with the DBP.

2. Lorch Assault is one of the higher voted maps that needs to be removed because it is FULL of buildings and everyone camps mortars, yet it makes it into the 4v4 tournament.

3. We need a 4v4 map contest fast, since clearly only about four of the current maps are any good for tournament play. I am including Hill 400 which some may feel is too small and has cancerous cutoffs.

A few observations:
[...]
3. We need a 4v4 map contest fast, since clearly only about four of the current maps are any good for tournament play. I am including Hill 400 which some may feel is too small and has cancerous cutoffs.

This is a joke, or?
A 4on4 map contest? You would need a lot of time to make and prepare maps. I had already problems to create 2 maps for the 2on2 contest in time. Furthermore the lack of active mappers will be increased by a 4on4 mapping contest. I think at the moment you have 5~6 active mappers left (see the contest). There were already just a handful map makers for the last contest. For a 4on4 contest the number would drop again.
Above all Relic would need a well organised contest, strong rules, high quality judges and a lot of time and preparation plus a bigger prize pool (to gives prizes to more people - perhaps that would motivate more "potential map makers").
The other way would be a Relic supported community mapping group where map makers could try to combine their efforts and work to produce new maps. But to be honest basing on the amount of time you will need for such a 4on4 map you would need to "pay" (reward, pay, dont know) those mappers.

Without the active engagement by Relic you wont get new maps here. Perhaps you can find a number of maps at the workshop but i'm not sure that the map creators would be active to fix and adjust their maps for pvp rotation.

To be honest i cant see any new map content for the large group games in the future.

A lot of existing maps, at least official relic ones, would be great candidates for being modified.

Many 4v4 and 3v3 maps could be fixed/improved given the opportunity.

Rather than kicking these out, we could have discussions on how they could be improved.

Way easier than making whole new maps from scratch.

A few observations:

1. The 2v2 map contest is not using any of the urban or industrial maps that have buildings. The first tournament after the contest has three of six maps FULL of buildings. Lorch Assault and Lienne Forrest are current soviet Urban Defense instawins. Will be interesting to test these with the DBP.

2. Lorch Assault is one of the higher voted maps that needs to be removed because it is FULL of buildings and everyone camps mortars, yet it makes it into the 4v4 tournament.

3. We need a 4v4 map contest fast, since clearly only about four of the current maps are any good for tournament play. I am including Hill 400 which some may feel is too small and has cancerous cutoffs.

1) Liene Forest is one of the most played and picked maps in cups

2) Forward HQ does not really work vs a premade axis team. Vs randoms and people who don't know to deal with it yes there it works

3) Look at the post from Lord Rommel. And hill400 too small? Its too large and no flanks possible^^. And you never can have double fuel

1) Liene Forest is one of the most played and picked maps in cups

2) Forward HQ does not really work vs a premade axis team. Vs randoms and people who don't know to deal with it yes there it works

3) Look at the post from Lord Rommel. And hill400 too small? Its too large and no flanks possible^^. And you never can have double fuel

1) Because people are dumb does not make it valid

2) Forward HQ works against everyone always. I played some high level guys the other day and kept them at bay and had double the scores of everyone playing because I went Urban Defense. And I suck. On Lienne Forrest you get a RUS and BRIT with forward HQ and its RIP GG.

3) 4v4 maps are not that much bigger or at least do not need to be much bigger since most 4v4 maps have about 40% of their main area that never sees play at all. Could be a lake which takes 30 seconds to make. Not sure how many times I have played redball and went "Whats over here? I have never been over there....ever...." Fields of Winnenkendonk could be turned into a 4v4 in about 3 hours. Now getting enough players to test a 4v4 is the real problem. That is why we have not seen one yet. But I can imagine Currahee and Hooligan could get us some players if asked nicely

You guys are missing the point just to argue (cause coh2 players love to argue ). The 4v4 map pool is weak at best. Most of the maps are beautiful so they could be fixed up as ZombiFrancis suggests (and may already be happening for the patch). Or we could maybe get another contest going. Rural only? Seems to be everyones favorite. Spit out a couple good maps.

The maps could also be tested 3v3 since there are almost no 3v3 maps. Angermunde FULL of buildings. Its just so poetic.

1) Because people are dumb does not make it valid

2) Forward HQ works against everyone always. I played some high level guys the other day and kept them at bay and had double the scores of everyone playing because I went Urban Defense. And I suck. On Lienne Forrest you get a RUS and BRIT with forward HQ and its RIP GG.

3) 4v4 maps are not that much bigger or at least do not need to be much bigger since most 4v4 maps have about 40% of their main area that never sees play at all. Could be a lake which takes 30 seconds to make. Not sure how many times I have played redball and went "Whats over here? I have never been over there....ever...." Fields of Winnenkendonk could be turned into a 4v4 in about 3 hours. Now getting enough players to test a 4v4 is the real problem. That is why we have not seen one yet. But I can imagine Currahee and Hooligan could get us some players if asked nicely

You guys are missing the point just to argue (cause coh2 players love to argue ). The 4v4 map pool is weak at best. Most of the maps are beautiful so they could be fixed up as ZombiFrancis suggests (and may already be happening for the patch). Or we could maybe get another contest going. Rural only? Seems to be everyones favorite. Spit out a couple good maps.

The maps could also be tested 3v3 since there are almost no 3v3 maps. Angermunde FULL of buildings. Its just so poetic.

You know that maybe in DBP forward hq got nerfed?

And i just can tell you: watch the 4vs4 finale game on attack on lorch. How the axis easy beat forward hq on this map.

And i agree its hart to find 8 same skilled players. To have really fair team.

About angermünde yes. If you are south side then forward hq is great on enemy cutoff fuel. From north side its harder to use.
And if you don't go for forward hq hf to flank on this map kappa^^

You know that maybe in DBP forward hq got nerfed?

That is what I said in my original post:
"Lorch Assault and Lienne Forrest are current soviet Urban Defense instawins. Will be interesting to test these with the DBP."

My point is that in the 2v2 contest many maps were pulled because of buildings, yet 50% of the maps in the tourney are all buildings. You cant have it both ways. Either buildings are bad or they are not.

But I can see the need to test building maps with the DBP since garrison times have been changed considerably.

That is what I said in my original post:
"Lorch Assault and Lienne Forrest are current soviet Urban Defense instawins. Will be interesting to test these with the DBP."

My point is that in the 2v2 contest many maps were pulled because of buildings, yet 50% of the maps in the tourney are all buildings. You cant have it both ways. Either buildings are bad or they are not.

But I can see the need to test building maps with the DBP since garrison times have been changed considerably.

You know that the playerbase from 2vs2 and 4vs4 is difference or? Also the gamestyles.

But i agree, new 4vs4 maps would be great and funny. But will not happen.

And in the 4vs4 cup. They still can play on steppe or redball. If they want to.

Lienne and Lanzerath could both be immensely improved by changing come central large tree groves with traversible terrain with tree cover, shrubs, and/or hedges.

Destroying, damaging, rotating, and/or replacing garrisons with ones with different amounts of windows could improve a ton of maps, not even just 4v4s.

Lienne and Lanzerath could both be immensely improved by changing come central large tree groves with traversible terrain with tree cover, shrubs, and/or hedges.

Destroying, damaging, rotating, and/or replacing garrisons with ones with different amounts of windows could improve a ton of maps, not even just 4v4s.

Not sure if you saw this:

http://www.companyofheroes.com/blog/2017/10/30/company-of-heroes-2-december-update

We’re also stoked to be implementing a meaty map balance update which will affect many of the maps within the game. Serious credit goes to SoE-Sturmpanther for coordinating the effort, and to map making experts Capiqua, Siphon X, Pigsoup, Lord Rommel, MonolithicBacon and Whiteflash. Their time and expertise have made this fantastic update possible. The result will be more fun, balanced and competitive maps. A huge win for everyone. Get ready to reset your vetoes!

I saw it. That doesn't really explain anything. My guess is only those people named there have any clue as to what "meaty map balance update" entails.

Removing maps and implementing the 2v2 maps could easily cover everything that is said there.

Are you saying that existing maps have been edited/updated in some way?

I saw it. That doesn't really explain anything. My guess is only those people named there have any clue as to what "meaty map balance update" entails.

Removing maps and implementing the 2v2 maps could easily cover everything that is said there.

Are you saying that existing maps have been edited/updated in some way?

"will affect many of the maps within the game"

Yes big Rework for "old" maps As far it was allowed to do.

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