Some 2v2 help

explanation in the replay thread. Mittens had trouble with triple Obersoldataen IRStGs... Heavy armor at the end overwhelmed us, schwerer HQs prevented us from pushing their cutoff or just pushing into their territory, and vetted OKW infantry was no match for my vet 2 replacement infantry.

Anyway, I still think Jaeger light Infantry from scavenge doctrine are stupidly OP at their current crit %. Vet 3 con was hardly winning against a vet 1 or vet 0 JLI at the end; nearly wiped when a second one came in firing from max range.

StG Obers, as well as Ober suppression @ vet 4, is broken.

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  ~TAB~MittenZ ~TAB~ GBPirate

  Hudcool HGR_Boessan

  Moscow Winter 2v2

  by: Gbpirate map: Moscow Outskirts Winter

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explanation in the replay thread. Mittens had trouble with triple Obersoldataen IRStGs... Heavy armor at the end overwhelmed us, schwerer HQs prevented us from pushing their cutoff or just pushing into their territory, and vetted OKW infantry was no match for my vet 2 replacement infantry.

Anyway, I still think Jaeger light Infantry from scavenge doctrine are stupidly OP at their current crit %. Vet 3 con was hardly winning against a vet 1 or vet 0 JLI at the end; nearly wiped when a second one came in firing from max range.

StG Obers, as well as Ober suppression @ vet 4, is broken.

•  
  

  0

  VS

  ~TAB~MittenZ ~TAB~ GBPirate

  Hudcool HGR_Boessan

  Moscow Winter 2v2

  by: Gbpirate map: Moscow Outskirts Winter

  1

  -

Hi there, i`m not at home so i can`t review your replay. So my goal with this post is to examine your thinking and suggest a potential stratagem that may work for against double OKW, rather then critiquing your play and risk offending you for "bad/stupid moves". So here are a few questions to consider.

1. What kind of suppression are you using to blob control? (OKW is inherently bloby)
2. What kind of artillery support are you using? (bleed) are you coordinating this fire? (truck removal)
3. What doctrines are you choosing against double OKW?

The overall problem you`re describing is the infamous OKW late game. I`ve found the best way to counter OKW late game, is to delay it. It`s called late game because it happens eventually. We all know OKW has a pretty damn good lategame - so why not postpone it? The USF + SU mix in 2v2 is one of the highest pressure combos in the 2v2 game mode and in my opinion one of the best early / midgame combos currently. Now, I understand that OKW is also a high pressure blob like faction, but the allied combo has access to suppression before double OKW, can match the OKW in infantry spam, has superior light vehicles (stuart, t70, quad, flacktrack) and superior light vehicle counter play (guards, zook rifles, captain, con AT nades).

Here are some video examples against some rank 200 ish - arranged team - opponents. We used the same strategy twice against same team.


http://www.twitch.tv/troyd_destin/v/33606216 - Minsk pocket
http://www.twitch.tv/troyd_destin/v/33603482 - Lierneux


Some things to notice

1. We use MGs and quads as backline units to suppress volks units in succession, this gives our infantry the decisive win in an engagement or forces a retreat.
2. Even if we`re not killing volks squads, we`re limiting their effectiveness and limiting their ability to move.
3. As a result of the above two points, those schewrs (see minks video) get built in a very conservative position. Guess what, we have room to move around!
4. As a result of the above 3, we now have OKW players centralized in a single area and we can constantly bombard that region with pak howtizers, mortars and rocket vehicles (calliope / katyusha).

Bonus points: Controlling Vps means the game will end sooner, reducing the chance of reaching late game. Longer games = More axis power.



The goal of a high pressure strategy is to delay your opponents late game as long as possible, and force OKW`s primary source for area denial (Schwers) to be placed as far back as possible - making them pretty awful area deniers. By restricting the movement of infantry, you limit their ability to Vet. So you won`t encounter vet 4 obersoldten, or vet 5 volks blobs. If for whatever reason you end up in late game, utilize the allied artillery advantage to bleed the OKW infantry dry (shell retreat points) and destroy their buildings (coordinate your artillery fire on a single OKW truck in one massive barrage). Eventually your OKW opponent will end up with 1 or 2 squads and some tanks. Any new squads they are building are now fresh and have no veterancy. Leaving you to leverage massed AT guns, jacksons and SU-85s with endless snaring infantry to destroy the KingTiger, jadgtiger - whatever they have left.

To your points about JLI and obersdolten vet 4/5 squads. The best thing you can do is not let them get 4 or 5. You should also keep in mind, that vet 4 and 5 for these units was actually nerfed in the last patch. Those amazing veterancy bonuses are the reward for an OKW player keeping his shit alive under immense allied early/mid pressure and late game artillery. So, that begs the question - how does one prevent them from getting vet 4 or 5? Short answer: Deny experience or wipe them. Long answer below.

1. don`t engage them in a losing situation (no vet for them, saves you manpower), avoid long range fights. Ideally engage with overwhelming numbers and get to close range.
2. Restrict their movement using suppression platforms (less exp for them in a fight). Or use that suppression platform to allow your cons to win the engagement. (as noted in yoru cons being wiped by JLIs statement)
3. Shell their retreat point (potential wipes)
4. Run down retreating squads with light vehicles or medium tanks, assuming its safe. (Potential wipes)
5. Bleed elite units with SU snipers, the OKW player will often retreat them early to avoid wipes. Also 3 man squad doesn`t get as much experience as a 4 man squad!


tldr; If you`re in a situation where you are facing 3 vet 4 obersoldtens and massed heavy armor. You`ve done something wrong during the early and mid game where Allies have the advantage.

I hope these suggestions help, feel free to aks follow up quetsions. I know this isn`t a direct critque of your gameplay.