Some fix needed for Stormtroopers

I like they are now in other doctrine than encircle, but they need some fixes I think.

1. Insane XP needed for vet up need to be decreased
I can't believe this unit need more xp to vet up than an assault gun. Why? Does this unit shred more inf than stug E or something? Even vet is similar to panzergren, nothing that huge.
It needs to be aligned to the level of other elite inf.

2. Dat muni cost...
This unit require too much muni to upgrade stg package. 100 to gain as same DPS as a panzergren, and spend more muni every time to perform better than panzergren.(It's a double edge sword though.) Camo upgraded panzergren would do almost the same work as they do now.
It's not same unit like panzergren and partisans, I know. But this only call-in inf unit that Ostheer can get looks just overpriced for what it cost.
It should, at least, cost less to upgrade stg44. Or give them two stg from the call-in, and give them two more (and tactical advance skill) with a upgrade. Or give them smoke grenade.

By the way, does G43 that Stormtroopers use is gren's one or panzergren's one? It should use panzergrens one, and I'm not sure about what it is.
edit- It uses gren's g43, so it needs to be changed with panzergren's g43.

edit2- bundled nade need some adjustment too... plz Relic

The g43s for storms is the gren g43 stats.

Agree with this.
They should use some amo costs and some vet requirements decrease.

The g43s for storms is the gren g43 stats.

Hmm, then it should be fixed also. Thanks.

Even as a self-confessed USF fanboy I agree. There's very few instances where I'd recommend Stormtroopers over regular panzergrenadiers. While they're at it they should fixed bundled grenades.

Even as a self-confessed USF fanboy I agree. There's very few instances where I'd recommend Stormtroopers over regular panzergrenadiers. While they're at it they should fixed bundled grenades.

Good point. I didn't add it to the post because I other people saying it on recent balance forum.
I'll add it now then.

I use them with stg and tactical assault to wipe some squad capping some useless point or then i mess with them into enemy squad retreat path and with tacassault= squadwipe. I always thought about them not as mainline unit but as tricky unit that can with some amound of planing and coordination wipe several squads

Like all garrison call in units they should come out with their weapons. This includes paratroopers.

Falls don't need upgrade, partisans don't need an upgrade, jaegers don't need an upgrade, all of these are good, balanced and viable.

I use them with stg and tactical assault to wipe some squad capping some useless point or then i mess with them into enemy squad retreat path and with tacassault= squadwipe. I always thought about them not as mainline unit but as tricky unit that can with some amound of planing and coordination wipe several squads

Planning and coordinations... Hmm. It sounds like it has less places to perform.

Tactical Advance itself isn't bad. Just 100 muni investment to get STG seems a bit overpriced, especially when you consider that it is as same as panzergren.

Planning and coordinations... Hmm. It sounds like it has less places to perform.

Tactical Advance itself isn't bad. Just 100 muni investment to get STG seems a bit overpriced, especially when you consider that it is as same as panzergren.

you pay 90 munny for demo (squadwipe) so what is bad for paying 100 munny and then always 25 for new and new suqadwipes ?

if enemy know you have them he cannot make huge pushes because he feares them (messing in retreat path = gg squad)

I like they are now in other doctrine than encircle, but they need some fixes I think.

1. Insane XP needed for vet up need to be decreased
I can't believe this unit need more xp to vet up than an assault gun. Why? Does this unit shred more inf than stug E or something? Even vet is similar to panzergren, nothing that huge.
It needs to be aligned to the level of other elite inf.

2. Dat muni cost...
This unit require too much muni to upgrade stg package. 100 to gain as same DPS as a panzergren, and spend more muni every time to perform better than panzergren.(It's a double edge sword though.) Camo upgraded panzergren would do almost the same work as they do now.
It's not same unit like panzergren and partisans, I know. But this only call-in inf unit that Ostheer can get looks just overpriced for what it cost.
It should, at least, cost less to upgrade stg44. Or give them two stg from the call-in, and give them two more (and tactical advance skill) with a upgrade. Or give them smoke grenade.

By the way, does G43 that Stormtroopers use is gren's one or panzergren's one? It should use panzergrens one, and I'm not sure about what it is.
edit- It uses gren's g43, so it needs to be changed with panzergren's g43.

edit2- bundled nade need some adjustment too... plz Relic

I think you are using Storm trooper the same way you are using grens and panzergrens, this is wrong, Storm troopers are Ambush unit that can skill a full health squad in 2-3 second with his ability, G43 Stormtrooper is stupid, cause you dont have that insane ability provided by STG.

Hector posted the video (by Stormless) of how to use Stormtrooper the correct way.

If you want to use Stormtrooper like PG, why dont build PG ?

you pay 90 munny for demo (squadwipe) so what is bad for paying 100 munny and then always 25 for new and new suqadwipes ?

if enemy know you have them he cannot make huge pushes because he feares them (messing in retreat path = gg squad)

The video shows how you use it right. But at least the enemy didn't press retreat button instantly.

And aside that, what about requirement for vet?

The video shows how you use it right. But at least the enemy didn't press retreat button instantly.

And aside that, what about requirement for vet?

- Not everyone can press retreat in less than 1.5 sec, retreat was useless anyway, cause he was in USF retreat path

I think you are using Storm trooper the same way you are using grens and panzergrens, this is wrong, Storm troopers are Ambush unit that can skill a full health squad in 2-3 second with his ability, G43 Stormtrooper is stupid, cause you dont have that insane ability provided by STG.

Hector posted the video (by Stormless) of how to use Stormtrooper the correct way.

If you want to use Stormtrooper like PG, why dont build PG ?

Well, somebody might add g43 on panzerschreck upgraded squad, or just medium-strong camo squd. Who knows?

Of course I know they do better AI job in STG packages. But that does not mean it is can be used with maximum impact on every situation, especially maps with less stuffs to cover.

I didn't say it need buffs in performance. Just the price to upgrade STG.
They cost quite amount of manpower without ST and four-man squad. It's okay.
But require 100 muni for upgrade in addition to that? It's too much.
If stg cost 75 muni, would not even bother to write second part of my opening post.

- Not everyone can press retreat in less than 1.5 sec, retreat was useless anyway, cause he was in USF retreat path

It took 3.4 seconds or a bit to wipe, and it was best case of how it can be used.
That exact moment rifle needed 1.5 seconds to survive, but does the enemy will do same mistake next time? I don't think so. That skill is not guaranteed wipe magic.

Well, somebody might add g43 on panzerschreck upgraded squad, or just medium-strong camo squd. Who knows?

Of course I know they do better AI job in STG packages. But that does not mean it is can be used with maximum impact on every situation, especially maps with less stuffs to cover.

I didn't say it need buffs in performance. Just the price to upgrade STG.
They cost quite amount of manpower without ST and four-man squad. It's okay.
But require 100 muni for upgrade in addition to that? It's too much.
If stg cost 75 muni, would not even bother to write second part of my opening post.

In the 100 muni cost you only see the STG, when i see the Tactical Advance ability added.
Ambush damage bonus + Tactical Advance = insanity

STG should cost like obers one. I think this one is overpriced and ober stg is uderpriced. Both need to be 75 munny (and lmg 34 too)

It took 3.4 seconds or a bit to wipe, and it was best case of how it can be used.
That exact moment rifle needed 1.5 seconds to survive, but does the enemy will do same mistake next time? I don't think so. That skill is not guaranteed wipe magic.

Maybe yes maybe no. But you can still use them near you cut off and then uleash power after fight get hard so he dont even notice they are under fire in less than 1-2 seconds. ALso you can always mess with enemy retreat path.

It took 3.4 seconds or a bit to wipe, and it was best case of how it can be used.
That exact moment rifle needed 1.5 seconds to survive, but does the enemy will do same mistake next time? I don't think so. That skill is not guaranteed wipe magic.

What mistake ? walk somewhere in the map ? You cant prevent a good ambush, and they can ambush from Any cover, will you avoid every Green / Yellow cover in the map ? will you call a Recon run each time you want to move ?

I have to point out that in the video the Squad is half health.

Further more a PG squad with camo performs better than stormtroopers for only 30 muni (accept the time during the ability use), with the camo actually providing a bonus.

So the only thing S.T. going for them is the ability to deploy behind enemy lines and an munition hungry ability.

I would rather make the ability weaker and weapon upgrade cheaper. Also have a look at the shreck upgrade that seems to be U.P.