Counter KV8/Croco as OKW

Hey guys

after a period of salt and whine I learned to adapt and I am finally able to have fun at the game again

There is one problem still left:
How do I counter flame tanks in 1v1 as OKW?

I had a game against Hector some days ago and it was a close one (in my opinion) in the early/mid game. The map was mostly split in half the whole time and I managed to bleed his MP a lot but after the KV8 arrived the gg arrived 2 minutes later.

Map was Kholodny Ferma and I started on the left. I also got a JP4 which only bounced the KV8 like a Basketball. My 4 Volksgrenadiers with Shrecks died in seconds and the Raketenwerfer only faced the KV8 with it's ass until it burned to ashes.

I had to get out the JP4 soon because his T70 brought fear to my troops. Fuel for Panther was not enough and mun for mining was not enough.

Hector surely played better than me but I just want to know how to counter these tanks because they destroy every inf and paks in seconds and there is no tank that penetrates it reliabely other than the Panther/KT.

If I got more Raketenwerfers, his Schocks would have even wiped me more than they already did.

(Sorry no Replay because I'm at work)

Interresting JP4 should do a great job against a KV8, did you put mines that surely helps alot

Interresting JP4 should do a great job against a KV8, did you put mines that surely helps alot

Thank you for your reply, my friend!

I also thought that but my JP4 either bounced his shots or missed them and Hector did a good job at blocking my line of sight by driving his KV8 behind sight blockers.
Maybe it was just bad luck but still.

I placed some mines but they mostly exploded because of infantry and I didn't have much munitions to spend because I got Schrecks to all my Volks.

Thank you for your reply, my friend!

I also thought that but my JP4 either bounced his shots or missed them and Hector did a good job at blocking my line of sight by driving his KV8 behind sight blockers.
Maybe it was just bad luck but still.

I placed some mines but they mostly exploded because of infantry and I didn't have much munitions to spend because I got Schrecks to all my Volks.

Yea, when playing against more skilled players it's hard to lure them into mines, i suggest putting mines behind your troops so he will thinks there is no mines and he will feel over confident or somewhere you are sure only the kv8 will go, i like to play like this so when a tank rush in my base, it hit one mines and cannot follow my troops and it's an easy kill to pick up

But the RNG can be crucial, a couple miss or bounce and it's drama

Shrecks have lower priority than mines/granades/lmg34s/g43s. If you really need to save munition then one shreck is okay just to protect flanks aiming at your armor/raketenwefer.

Plaster the map with mines, so that he will be afraid even to move an inch without having a sweeper nearby.
The JP4 is the perfect counter - good dps and long range. It just seems that RNG god was not smiling upon you. In addition cloaked raketenwerfer can help but likewise get easily decrewed by the KV8 if the JP4 is not nearby.

Also Pak43 does a good job, the incendiary artillery strike only decrews it and doesn't destroy it, so it's a good counter for the shock rifle doctrine in general.

Hey guys

after a period of salt and whine I learned to adapt and I am finally able to have fun at the game again

There is one problem still left:
How do I counter flame tanks in 1v1 as OKW?

I had a game against Hector some days ago and it was a close one (in my opinion) in the early/mid game. The map was mostly split in half the whole time and I managed to bleed his MP a lot but after the KV8 arrived the gg arrived 2 minutes later.

Map was Kholodny Ferma and I started on the left. I also got a JP4 which only bounced the KV8 like a Basketball. My 4 Volksgrenadiers with Shrecks died in seconds and the Raketenwerfer only faced the KV8 with it's ass until it burned to ashes.

I had to get out the JP4 soon because his T70 brought fear to my troops. Fuel for Panther was not enough and mun for mining was not enough.

Hector surely played better than me but I just want to know how to counter these tanks because they destroy every inf and paks in seconds and there is no tank that penetrates it reliabely other than the Panther/KT.

If I got more Raketenwerfers, his Schocks would have even wiped me more than they already did.

(Sorry no Replay because I'm at work)

Actually i can help you in this game from my view of point (because i played that game :hansGG

I was able to attack your cut off and munition pretty well (i think)
Also you didnt make any great counterattacks + clown car put nice pressure on you.

Also that t70 continued to bring fear down to you.


But thats something else.

Now im gonna explain you that kv8.

As many players already mentioned - place mines.

Also i managed to damage engine on your JP4 so i can circle starfe and kill your jp4

While jp4 may be great counter to kv8 i would recommend flakhq + p4 more because you can nicely cover your fuel and cut off with that hq and p4 fight of kv8 with rakethen support and also fight agains pesky cons and shocks that tried to kill your poor volks and raketens.

Last think: dont be afraid agains kv 8 , in next patch it get nerfed (because it is lithe bit OpieOP righ now) so you will fight agains it much easier later.


And last think. defend that munny house better it will help you to get more fuel = better counters to kv8

EDIT: More thinks that i noticed :

Your army composition was not good - you had jp4 and volks and leigt. Really bad agains infantry + you have no agressive unit so i was able to just do what i want with my vehilces + you was not able to harras me due that kv8 and your missing agressive units.

Also i ve had no AT gun only few mines and cons at nades because i know you wont be albe to make another tank before my IS2 due my mid game map control + your lack of ai infantry (like panzerfussiliers) and mobile tank

Hi Hi5ee

My 02c worth from a Soviet and OKW 1v1 player perspective, which admittedly, as OKW in the particular I am still sorely learning and think have some serious holes in their composition.

First Crocs, which are so absurdly OP that I won't even deign to discuss them attempting reason. A super-serious nerfing required.

KV-8s OTOH are a great unit, especially vs OKW, but not invulnerable. They do shred all infantry, so as you elaborate, multiple 'shreck squads whether blobbed or even triangulated are tantamount to useless IME playing OKW vs or as Soviets with KV-8. Fact is AFAIAC, OKW just lack solid hard counter AT. Racketenwerfers are short-ranged rubbish relative to all other factions' AT guns.

That said, I'm with the others on the Jagdpanzer IV/L70 as OKW's best available timely solution. Reliance upon mines, whilst not disputing their effectiveness, is fraught with too many "ifs" unless the map constricts pathing through chokepoints or a highly probable traffic lane. And they are too easily negated by mortar fire. Problem with the Jagdpanzer is that it needs to be built (time) rather than being a call in, so it needs to be fielded already, and because it is a Jagdpanzer, accurate anticipatory pre-positioning is paramount to its effectiveness.

Against a better player who will retreat his KV at the first hit, it's unlikely IME that the Jagdpanzer will kill it. But it will contain and restrict his otherwise freedom of manoeuvre. If the Soviet uses dual AT gun creep in conjunction with the KV-8, given that the KV-8 will force infantry retreat allowing AT freedom of movement without risk of infantry overrun, that spells big trouble for OKW IME, forcing the Jagdpanzer to retreat as well because of the fuel resource model seldom allowing the timely fielding of two solid pieces of armour against an able Soviet opponent.

Of course, it's highly situational depending upon losses, but except against an exceptional OKW player who has well above outstanding unit preservation skills, I'd rather be the Soviet than the OKW player every time in this situation.

Last night BTW although a 2v2 auto example rather than 1v1, on Minsk Pocket a map I detest playing regardless, as double Soviet vs double OKW I selected a Soviet Commander with KV-8 call in ability. Late game, I called in a single KV-8 causing both infantry heavy OKW players to flee centre map with immense damage to their infantry and decrewing of almost all their support weapons before they could adequately counter. This then permitted us to creep our AT guns supported by Maxims and Shock Troops so as to destroy two thence unsupported forward deployed OKW command trucks. As the KV-8 moved to attack a third deployed truck and its supporting weapons (Raketenwerfer, stolen MG42 in bunker and Fallshirmjägers), my opponent immediately panic called in a King Tiger to save it. His partner subsequently called in a Jagdtiger. Not unsurprisingly, I beat a hasty retreat with my KV-8. To their credit, they used this armour combined to good effect albeit hampered by the natural restricted speed and manouvreability of heavy TD/tank. They were frightened to come at our centre map AT gun shield with good reason due their number and positioning, and so moved them elsewhere to press us for a VP victory.

The pair certainly contained my KV-8 movement of which I had called in a second to exploit another vulnerability prior to the appearance of the first KT, which in hindsight was a mistake and which caution could have forseen. I was trying to be opportunistically exploitive and underestimated the MP float they must have had. But, hey, it's a RTS pressure game. We make mistakes.

Anyway, as it turned out, on the right hand corner flag flank I contained them and their blobs with AT guns supported by a maxim, mortar and infantry to maintain the critical flag neutral until we could recap it, although they did get one of my KV-8s with the combo. My 2v2 partner had rammed the Jagdtiger with a T-34/76 (losing it in the process) but seriously disabling the Jagdtiger. He then built an Su-85 and I called in an IS-2 whilst they hesitated with the KT remaining to support the crippled Jagdtiger whilst our infantry battled it out trying to assert local supremacy so we could creep out AT guns forward without risk of infantry overrun of their crews. OKW were forced to retreat the infantry blob due losses in the infantry melee further motivated by some timely incendiary arty at which we instantly charged with the IS-2 and Su-85 also creeping our x2 AT guns on that flank forward. We lost both Su-85 and IS-2 to the Jagdtiger + King Tiger combo, so they are undeniably formidable, but killed the Jagdtiger in the process as well as crippling and badly damaging the King Tiger. With infantry support we then crept the AT guns forward to finish it off. At this, our opponents decided they'd had enough. Game over. They were both much higher auto ranked BTW.

So KT or Jagdtiger are good hard counters for OKW, but probably not timely enough in a 1v1 IME as you'll possibly agree? And to be fair, should OKW really have to rely upon 1. a doctrinal call in, and 2. such a late high CP unit which should be and is the equivalent or better of an IS-2 just to deal with a KV-8?

OKW sorely needs better early and mid-game hard counter AT IMV. Maybe the OKW l33t players can deal, but I am fairly certain the average player struggles with this perpetually. If someone has a real and effective practical solution, I am sure I will be as "all ears" to listen to it as you will.

Maybe it's not ideal but I find 2-3 pumas will take care of kv8s no problem. I just had a match last night where this was effective. Just my 2 cents.

Pak43 is the one that deals with it for me

Hey guys

after a period of salt and whine I learned to adapt and I am finally able to have fun at the game again

There is one problem still left:
How do I counter flame tanks in 1v1 as OKW?

I had a game against Hector some days ago and it was a close one (in my opinion) in the early/mid game. The map was mostly split in half the whole time and I managed to bleed his MP a lot but after the KV8 arrived the gg arrived 2 minutes later.

Map was Kholodny Ferma and I started on the left. I also got a JP4 which only bounced the KV8 like a Basketball. My 4 Volksgrenadiers with Shrecks died in seconds and the Raketenwerfer only faced the KV8 with it's ass until it burned to ashes.

I had to get out the JP4 soon because his T70 brought fear to my troops. Fuel for Panther was not enough and mun for mining was not enough.

Hector surely played better than me but I just want to know how to counter these tanks because they destroy every inf and paks in seconds and there is no tank that penetrates it reliabely other than the Panther/KT.

If I got more Raketenwerfers, his Schocks would have even wiped me more than they already did.

(Sorry no Replay because I'm at work)

Have fun? In COH2? That's borderline impossible.