T1/T2 or T1+T2

Since the new patch has decreased the cost for building T1 and T2. Do you guys go for only one, or prefer to go for both?

I usually play 4v4 and to me T2 is a must for most of the maps - ZiS and Maxim. But I must admit that I quite like Penals for their AI capacity. But if I go for T1, I only go for Penals - seldom have snipers, and never make the scout car.

What do you guys choose and most importantly how to make the use of T1 and T2 better with conscripts?

Depends on your plan.
The problem with the soviet T1 is that this is a very offensive and situational tier.
Penals : rush peoples, burn them
Sniper : force the ennemy to engage you/counter MG
Car : fast attack, burn them sooner

Another problem with the tier 1 is that it scales very badly with the late game, where teamgames tend to focus. The units produced dies very (very) easily and are very vulnerable to explosions (which tend to be quite frequent in the lategame).
Likewise, if you compare the conscript with the penals, you can notice several things :
Both cost the same and are anti infantery at the begining, the penal beeing twice more deadly at close range and the cons beeing more resistant and deadly at long range.
If you add upgrades, the penal become even more deadly at close range and the cons become more polyvalent (Atgrenades, molotov, ppsh, ptrs).
As the game progress, penals will die faster and faster and conscripts will still have theyr uses, capping an throwing grenades.

The tier 2 on the other hand is a necessity in teamgame.
Sooner or later you ll need a PAK or two (or three) and maxims are useful from the begining to the end.


So
In teamgames,unless you have a very specific plan in mind for the earlygame, soviets players tend to skip T1 and focus on the more generalist and resilient units of the tier2.

Depends on your plan.
The problem with the soviet T1 is that this is a very offensive and situational tier.
Penals : rush peoples, burn them
Sniper : force the ennemy to engage you/counter MG
Car : fast attack, burn them sooner

Another problem with the tier 1 is that it scales very badly with the late game, where teamgames tend to focus. The units produced dies very (very) easily and are very vulnerable to explosions (which tend to be quite frequent in the lategame).
Likewise, if you compare the conscript with the penals, you can notice several things :
Both cost the same and are anti infantery at the begining, the penal beeing twice more deadly at close range and the cons beeing more resistant and deadly at long range.
If you add upgrades, the penal become even more deadly at close range and the cons become more polyvalent (Atgrenades, molotov, ppsh, ptrs).
As the game progress, penals will die faster and faster and conscripts will still have theyr uses, capping an throwing grenades.

The tier 2 on the other hand is a necessity in teamgame.
Sooner or later you ll need a PAK or two (or three) and maxims are useful from the begining to the end.


So
In teamgames,unless you have a very specific plan in mind for the earlygame, soviets players tend to skip T1 and focus on the more generalist and resilient units of the tier2.

Thanks! I thought it was a very important question in the new patch but it seems that it is actually not a question at all esp for 4v4 games. I think another exception is that you are flying with friends who know each other very well and then one can go for T1 for variety. But it seems that for automatch its saver to go for cons + T2.

For conscripts, I guess AT nades is always a must but how about medic and molotov? And when do you guys upgrade it in the new patch??? Also I used to love PPSH but I read from somewhere that no-PPSH helps to maintain conscripts mid-range DPS. How do you guys choose?

For T2, do you guys get the standard 82mm mortor? Or should get the commander with 120mm instead?

Honestly, molotovs are far from mandatory but i admit i pay for the upgrade almost every game that involve cityfight and heavy cover hugging and never regret it.
I usually do it after my 3rd or 4th conscript squad to rapidly decrew an ennemy MG. The upgrade itself is quick to reserch so you can buy it reactively when you expect that will be needed in the next fignt.
I think you can forget them on open maps (stepps?) as mobility is increased.

The medic is a different choice.
It costs as much as a new squad of cons/mortar/MG. So when you choose to build them you will have one less squad.
In terms of costs it is also equal to 12 reinforcements. Thats a lot.
So you can conclude that it is only interesting if you heal more than 12 wonded-but-not-dead mens.
But
Healing is nothing to laught at in this game. It can be heartbreaking to send a half-wounded squad back to fight as you know the squad will have to come back even more quickly and you will have to pay attention to not let her die.
Things gets more interesting if you heal bigger things that conscripts, especially Guards and Shock troops that costs 35 to reinforce or snipers that costs 90.

It is good to buy medics if :
-you are satisfied with your lineup and have an extra floating MP.
-you have elite infantery.

It is a upgrade i do very often now. In teamgames, Germans tend to build a lot of mortars/LeIG that wound a whole squad evenly rather than obliterating a single model each shot, justifying the cost.

I was thinking he other day about this s but the opposite end of the tech tree I.e how you used to be able to build either T3 or T4, or sometimes both and how Relic made T3 mandatory for T4.

Seemed really odd to me that Relic wanted more variation early game but.. Less in the mid game? It seemed to get lumped in with all the heavy-call in cap stuff.. Maybe to delay production of call-ins if you go fast T4 or some other reason, I dunno..

But I'd really like to see that removed because since they made it possible to get T1 and T2 it's made Soviets my favourite faction to play as, with the Su76 now in T3 as well they're a really versatile faction to play as and their heavy call-ins for the most part seem really... Satisfying.

I tend to build t1 + t2 in team games, in 1v1 il tailor my tech to my commander choice. It's always nice to have penals for AI and have guards as a safety net for long range and AT. If I go shocks Il tend to get support weapons out.
Definitely enjoying T1 at the moment though. scout car is great for chasing down kubels and stray squads, especially on big maps where you have room to chase, and there is NOTHING more gratifying than rolling a flamer clown car up to a group of ISGs and blasting the fuckers to oblivion with a satchel then crisping the strays up with the burner.

I've found that penal scale a little better into late game than conscripts, but conscripts give you much needed versatility. The scout car and snipers can be nasty early game but tend lose there effectiveness as the game progress. However going T1 and T2 can be costly on manpower early game and delays any armor of your trying to rush it. And if you skip T2 your missing out on much needed team weapons. Alot of people skip T1 and just use conscripts as there core infantry. If I'm feeling frisky then I'll just rush a clown flame car and kill and steal enemy team weapons early on when they are vunerable. If I can steal a mg or 2 plus a mortor if I'm lucky I won't need T2 and can just skip it.

I started going T1 starts when WFA came out just to counter the Konigskubel.

I stuck with it because it gives good early push and if you can find an early truck and take it out that's a big bonus and there is nothing worse than forcing your enemy to retreat and finding a truck set up you can't hurt.

T2 is more or less essential unless you have some other way to get AT or you really want to rely on your teammates

As such I usually do T1+T2 and don't build Cons


If I do build Cons, I don't bother with T1


So I think the really interesting decision is not T1 or T2, but whatelse do you do besides T2?


T2 by itself
Means spamming Maxims early game, and they are not so hot with all the indirect and fire about

T1+T2
As noted above

T0+T2
Attack with Cons, hold with T2 stuff

T0+T1+T2
That looks like such an investment in fuel and MP that either you aren't getting good value from everything so you can skip something OR your upkeep will suffocate your teching and lack of fuel delay it

I always get both.

I get T1 first for scout car/sniper. T2 I feel is necessary to get because you really need the option of Maxim/AT gun in the mid game, and the mortar is always useful. I play a very long early game, but I feel like my t3 vehicles still come out at a useful time.