Can we plz fix the Rifle nade?

Right now this nade as an ability is pretty broken and makes for a stale game. Its been broken for a few patches now and since the formation change its been over preforming in relation to other factions nades.

• Fire animation is broken half the time
  
• The "grenade" voice over is hard to hear and sometimes never goes off
  
• Its long range makes it hard to avoid/dodge
  
• It has a large AOE and can wipe 1-2 squads
  
• Almost the equivalent of having a precision mortar strike
  
  

This grenade is over preforming and requires adjustments or costs increases. While I understand Wher need good anti-blob as well as building options, the rifle nade is overdue for an adjustment. The grenade while having a long contrail after fired, its almost impossible to dodge/counter play. The "your men say 'Grenade' before its fired" isn't a fair enough argument to justify this abilities performance.

The grenade has a few options to make it more fair *These are suggestions and not all of them have to be implemented but the nade needs play more fairly in game*

Add a 1-2 sec timer could be a way to help make it more fair. Sure the ability has the time in between the shot fired but only if its shot at max range. All nades have this and make them easier to spot. Already other nades have this timer such as the bundle nade and the mkII so why not?

Increase cost: This would be the worst option to adjust the ability as wher already have huge Muni drains for mgs and mines but could decrease the frequency of the nades.

Reduce Range: the range could make it so the squad has to get closer to fire the rifle nade making it hard to fire on a whim over large areas of the map.

Reduce AOE profile: This could reduce the heavy squad wiping after the Unit formation and cover changes. Reducing the AOE profile would limit the size of the nade while still keeping its lethality like other nades in heavy to med cover. It shouldn't be able to wipe whole squads (not clumped) spaced out on heavy-light cover.

again these are all suggestions but there has to be something done for this to be more fair as an ability.

The only thing about the rifle nade that needs fixing is the vet 2 range and (like all grenades) needs to not be able to be fired while suppressed by a machine gun.

The only thing about the rifle nade that needs fixing is the vet 2 range and (like all grenades) needs to not be able to be fired while suppressed by a machine gun.

nuf said

I agree that it is too strong (especially or almost entirely vs weapon teams) but I think you overrate its AoE. It can wipe entire squads if they're really bunched up; wiping two squads with it is almost impossible unless, well, they stand on top of eachother.

Until Grens hit vet 2 RNs are mostly fine I think. The vet 2 bonus should get replaced by something else. In addition to that, all grenades shouldn't work while being suppressed (except for smoke).

Just fix formations

vet 2 range

Just a gentle reminder to always hug green cover if facing a rifle nade spammer; green cover reduces all damage taken by 40% including damage from riflenades.

It is really dumb that if a gren squad walks straight into an MG they can just click twice and wipe it. How that mechanic has stayed in this game so long baffles me.

Just a gentle reminder to always hug green cover if facing a rifle nade spammer; green cover reduces all damage taken by 50% including damage from riflenades.

FIFY

Rifle grenades are a bad game mechanic that makes the Wehrmacht basic infantry deal with static machine gun positions easily without the need for supporting units (like mortars), abilities (like smoke drops), or flanking maneuvers.

Simply replacing rifle grenades with regular grenades would make the game a lot more interesting as suddenly a lot more allied unit compositions become viable, which in return makes more Wehrmacht combinations viable.

Just today, 2 Grens were attacking my Cons inside bulding; they were on the open field (Vaux Farmland - attacking budiling next to north ammo)and next to each other, so I put Maxim at almost max range to suppress them and force to retreat.

Grens have crawled a bit, then fired rifle nades. Maxim wiped

Maybe we can give Rifles and Cons rifle nade? HMG42 won't be an issue any more

Cut down range of all nades by 50% when suppressed.

Triangle formation on MGS this patch makes it very tough for a rifle made to wipe an MG this patch.

The only thing that needs fixing is the sound playing after a cancel, and the vet 2 range.

It is one of the most telegraphed grenades in the game, with a loud report and a dude that actually takes a knee. If you can't dodge it, that's on you.

Rifle grenades are a bad game mechanic that makes the Wehrmacht basic infantry deal with static machine gun positions easily without the need for supporting units (like mortars), abilities (like smoke drops), or flanking maneuvers.

Simply replacing rifle grenades with regular grenades would make the game a lot more interesting as suddenly a lot more allied unit compositions become viable, which in return makes more Wehrmacht combinations viable.

Don't think I agree.
Replacing rifle nades with regular nades would also simply be a huge de facto nerf. Also, in a 1v1 situation, a riflenade will rarely wipe or kill a Maxim/Ma Deuce.

Cons and Rifles are both obviously better at flanking and close range combat than Grens are, which is balanced out by Grens static DPS with LMGs and their T1 support weaponry. In short, Mgs are auxiliary units for Allies, while they are essential to Wehr.

Grens are long range infantry. That reason alone is enough to keep the rifle grenade.

It makes sense since pgrens are med-range to close range infantry.

Relic is re-working vet, I suspect the vet 2 range will go away.

It is one of the most telegraphed grenades in the game, with a loud report and a dude that actually takes a knee. If you can't dodge it, that's on you.

I'd argue that it is one of the least telegraphed grenades in the game, because every other grenade throw starts with a squad having to close-in on their target. This type of telegraphing can even be seen on the mini-map. Rifle grenades on the other hand can come any time during a long range firefight, and these fire fights take longer than short ranged fights, requiring you to pay close attention to your squads for longer periods of time. Grenadiers also fire from the knee normally, sometimes fire the grenade before crouching and the sound is bugged.

Also Triangle formation does little to prevent your maxim crew from hurdling together at behind the same bit of cover. And maxims can't dodge rifle grenades unless you already started moving in advance.

Don't think I agree.
Replacing rifle nades with regular nades would also simply be a huge de facto nerf. Also, in a 1v1 situation, a riflenade will rarely wipe or kill a Maxim/Ma Deuce.

Cons and Rifles are both obviously better at flanking and close range combat than Grens are, which is balanced out by Grens static DPS with LMGs and their T1 support weaponry. In short, Mgs are auxiliary units for Allies, while they are essential to Wehr.

That is why Wehrmacht has such awesome support units like the sniper and the mortar. These units are good at what they do, better in fact than their allied counterparts, but are hardly used because allied support weapons are not viable. Why are they not viable? Because they get wrecked completely by rifle grenades.

Riflegrenade means maxims suck -> soviets don't make maxims, spam only cons -> Sniper and mortar don't do well vs conspam so Wehr player makes only MG42s and grens. The only way to break this cycle of blandness is to make allied HMGs viable, and that is impossible to do when each grenadier squad comes with a 30 ammo precision strike long range grenade.

And yeah.. Rifle grenades do in fact regularly clear out maxims/50cals/DHSKs from the front in a single hit.

Hm. Soviets also spam Conscripts because conscripts-en-masse-builds are very strong and have good synergies with all kinds of supplementary Soviet units, most noticeably recently Guards.

While the status quo might be bland, its also somewhat balanced, and if you take out one piece of the equation without changes elsewhere, this balance will suffer, which is all I am saying.

Making heavy use of conscript standbags (for that sweet 50% reduced green cover) really helps deal with rifle nade spammers. But Aerohank I think your putting the cart before the horse when it comes to riflenades being OP.

Is it bullshit that the sound/animation doesn't play? Yes it should be fixed.

Is it dumb that they can shoot as far as an MG can fire at vet 2? Oh yeah

Is it shitty that they can be fired while suppressed? You know it.

Those things need fixing, and after those are fixed if they are still vastly over preforming then we could get into the nitty gritty of how much damage they do.

honestly just dont put ur HMGs into compromising positions like clumping up in yellow cover until theyre changed, if ever. either put them in no cover to take advantage of their new formation or put them in green so they cant be wiped

Fix animations, change vet2, add in 33% reduced throwing range for all nades while suppressed. Any other issues, like its damage or AOE is either a L2P issue or being due to the above reasons.