Commanders - an overwhelming amount of options.

Greetings.

I recently started playing Company of Heroes 2 again.
Again? Yes

"Back in the day" I played a LOT of Company of Heroes 1 and absolutely loved it.

I preordered CoH2 pretty much as soon as that was possible but when it was released for some reason I didn't really get into it, possibly because it felt like the game was still in development and the whole commander and bulleting unlocking thing seemed like a pay2win system.

So I more or less shoved it off and whenever I felt like playing CoH I played the CoH1 steam version.


So now here we are a couple of years later and a friend of mine got CoH2 and was asking me to play. So I figured I'd give it another try and to my surprise I got lots of goodies when I started up the game and it feels almost like a different game now compared to when it was just released - in a good way - since I'm really enjoying it.

Now after we've got that out of the way, this is my actual problem. There are so many choices regarding commanders that I'm not sure what to go for.

Some are uncommon, some are rare. Does that mean those are strictly better?
I have looked at the commander guides - but that feels more like an explanation of the commanders with some tips. What I'm sort of looking for is a "choose commander X vs Y"-tierlist with explanation.

For example.

---------
When playing Soviet vs OKW
Tier 1
Commander A - Overall the best commander to pick, can react to most situations because..
Commander B - This commander is a toppick against OKW if they rush Armor because...
Commander C

Tier 2
Commander D
Commander E

Tier 3, Tier 4... Stay away from these, they are useless
-----------

Is it like that, if so is there something like that?

Or is it simply - you can pick any commander they are all balanced it only slightly enhances your play?

We were actually going to release a detailed mini guide that explained commander match ups in the near future.

A few examples are:

ISU commanders vs Elefant commanders, it's a bad choice to pick ISU vs someone with elefant doctrine

armor company vs mechanized assault,bad choice for mechanized assault because an M10 will counter your STUG E, and will cost effectively battle the tiger tank

There's soooo many match ups hat could be explained, might I ask which particular commanders you have in mind?

Great to hear about that mini guide, that will no doubt help a ton.

Currently for OKW and USF I don't have many issues, considering I only have 3 commanders for those.

But for the other 2 factions I simply don't know what to pick. I try to always have a mixture of 3 commanders that always have 1 more focussed on armor, 1 on infantry and 1 support-ish.

I'm Still trying them out, but considering there are so many I was sort of looking for a guide of sorts that can tell me which ones to focus on - if any.

Are there any pure crap commanders - as in, ones I should never use?
And vice vera are there commanders that should always be taken as one of the three?

As a STRATEGIST I won't tell you to just not try different commanders,always experiment.

All doctrines can work, some are more useful than others, that's all.

but, a good ALLIED lineup has:

Guard motor,mechanized support, and shock rifle frontline gives you access to everything you'll need in a game without too much overlap. As long as you don't pick your commander too early you can adapt to just about anything.

For Americans and OKW,, the standard 3 doctrines are arguably better than the "premium" or rare doctrines.

For Ostheer, a good versatile lineup would include one doctrine with tiger,another with Elefant/divebomb to
Counter howitzers,jaeger armor), and either Mobile defense, ostruppen,or Close air support, depending on what you have or what you like.

Hope that helps a little... Like I said a commander matchup guide is very much a work in progress!

Generally agree with Cokiez. It would interest me which game mode you play mostly, Grubb. This information can help a lot to specify our advice.

That surely helps Cookiez, thanks for that.

I currently play with some friends of mine, we're still in the phase of getting to know all the units and commanders. We've literally started playing again since like 2 weeks ago.

I expect we will mainly be playing 2v2 or 3v3 matches.

In CoH1 I also played the 1v1 ladder, when I am a bit more familiar with the game I will most likely pick that up again aswel.


Currently I enjoy OKW/Ostheer and USF the best.
USF riflespam is quite familiar to me and now they have bazooka's aswel.. good stuff

Ostheer feels quite like the Wehr from CoH1 albeit there's a lot less 'bunkering' yourself into a location.

I like the trucks OKW has, especially the alternative retreat point.


For some reason I can't get much done with the Soviets, I don't really like their infantry. Perhaps it's because I'm used to getting shrecks and all other 3 factions (if you count rifles with bazooka's) have something like that whereas the soviets seem to be lacking in that department.

I'm sure they can fill the role with other units, I just haven't played them that much yet.

Soviet anti tank grenades are a pretty huge threat, an engine damage tank is a dead tank, and conscripts being able to Oorah and throw the grenade is a huge advantage over other infantry Anti tank.

The key with soviets is to "snare" a vehicle with;

Mines on combat engineer
Guard rifle infantry Button ability(unlocked when you research DP LMG)
At grenades

And then finish with
Mark vehicle ability(increases damage inflicted to a target vehicle)
Zis-3 field gun
SU-85

If the tank you're trying to kill has a healthy engine or isn't marked with mark vehicle (or a combo of both)you're doing it wrong

The soviets just require more combinations to knock down heavier vehicles quickly., unless you have an IS2.
You also mentioned you were playing 2v2 or 3v3?
Make sure you each mix Commander choice into your team strategy to maximize your versatility as a team .(1 guy goes for guards and mark vehicle, the other goes for IS2, and another goes for ISU152,etc)

When you play 2v2 Axis I recommend to play mixed Axis offering you access to the heaviest tanks in game (Königstiger and Jagdtiger) combined with versatile Ostheer army to back them up.

Ostheer player should have Jäger Armor Doctrine, Luftwaffe Closed Air Support Doctrine and Tiger doctrine of his choice to be decent. Of course you can try other doctrines.

As for OKW, I think the 3 origin doctrines are most appropriate.

Combinations of these doctrines restrict strategy involving ISU-152 and Howitzers automatically. To fight versus medium tank spam is a matter of experience.

In 3v3 at least one Ostheer player is recommendable to counter howitzers and support OKW.

If only the were more legit commander options. I love experimenting and thinking outside the box with commanders, its more satisfying and can potentially surprise your opponent.


However, having said that, its hard to see past Elite Troops and Mechanised Assualt as Werh and Shock Rifle and Guards Motor as Sov

(OK sov has more viable options, but those 2 are mustard.. Werh is weaker on choices).

Some are uncommon, some are rare. Does that mean those are strictly better?

No, it relates to the chances of getting them


There is:

http://www.coh2.org/guides/31838/ostheer-101the-consolidated-guide-to-common-commanders

And a Sov one will be coming soon, which will cover builds and strats more because those matter more for Sov commander selection.


I've added sections on other commanders in the guides I have done, but that's not a universal feature and that's still, as you've said, focused around one commander

http://www.coh2.org/guides/29946/partisan-guide#1254

http://www.coh2.org/guides/29278/mechanised-assault-guide#1153

http://www.coh2.org/guides/30967/close-air-support-guide#1306



Tiering system is an idea I have had in the past based on this

Thanks for the replies everyone.

With the (mix of) commanders mentioned I now have a bit of a basis on where to start amongst all the choices.

Also nice to see some soviet AT tips.


As said I've only been playing for a while again. Once I get a bit more familiair with the game I will check out some more indepth guides that focus on specific commanders. There seem to be plenty of good guides on here.

@Van Voort: That looks like a nice in-depth tiering system which would make a lot of sense for a game like CoH since you're often building a unit to counter someone - so to have a sense of how a commander (or unit for that matter) would do in various situations would be of great value.

Ok, we'll see what we can do backstage.

If you want some specific advice, tell us the Commanders you have, factions and mode of play, what you like doing and what gives you issues and we can help you out

Tiers is up

http://www.coh2.org/guides/33767/commander-tiers

Wow thanks, time to take a look!