2v2 Crossing in the Woods

I would like someone to analyze this game, see what we could do better to counter the Axis players. It was a very good first twenty minutes; Med truck destroyed, fuels flipped between teams, no/few squad losses.


OKW got a KT out; it was killed very quickly with mark target, T34/85s, Su-85, and a flanking Jackson. His blob of Jaeger Light Infantry and Schreck volks couldn't stop it.

Problems I identified:
Elite troops + vetted Grenadiers
Vetted Mortars (either from upgrade or through killing)/ captured 120mm
Me spending 420 munitions on 3x LMG Airborne upgrades; only should have bought two, replaced second killed rifle with another rifle.
mis-microing my vet 3 AT gun, then having it killed by mortars. >_<


Thank you for your feedback

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  ~TAB~ EffenNewbie ~TAB~ GBPirate

  Brayalex. Skabinsk

  What went wrong?

  by: Gbpirate map: Crossing in the Woods

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Alright, here goes. Prepare yourself.

First thing I noticed were the two grenade bulletins you had. The second was the fact that it took you almost nine minutes to research them. It could have greatly improved your chances during the first OKW blob assault at ~3:40 when they charged your rifles. One grenade would have (probably) made them bleed quite a bit. Otherwise, when you see a massive force like that descending on you, don't waste your expensive riflemen and just retreat.

Excellent mortar and bunker takedown by your teammate at ~6:25.

At around 6:58 you were forced out of cover by a volk nade and proceeded to try and kill the sturm squad. You should have retreated (don't fight pointless battles against impossible odds, you just bleed MP) since you didn't have grenades.

Your teammate went for a strange T1 Soviet build with no scout cars. The Axis players had no AT weapons until 7:46 (that's when the first panzershcreck popped). An M3 with either an engineer w/ flamer or penal w/ flamer would have done massive damage to their infantry.

At ~7:40 you charged two entrenched Jager squads on the east side with no grenades and (unsurprisingly) lost. Again, unwinnable battles.

~8 Minutes the Penal squad providing infantry cover for your AAHT wanders off to cap. The fuel is important, true, but you had a chance to swiftly wipe their medic truck with the HT + satchels as well as possibly some infantry.

~9 Min be careful of shot blockers with your AA HT. It would have done much better sitting on the road with clear fields of fire.

General tip, but when intense combat is happening on one side of the map, send a "useless" squad like RE's or Engineers to go cap the other side (the minimap is especially helpful for this).

Around this time is when both of you begin to float MP. I know it can be difficult, but sending an RE squad to throw up a fuel cache is a good investment when you're kicking down their door.

Around 10 min is when you finally pick your commander. A little late imo, but ok. You drop an AT gun (good investment, no argument here), but you never get a single squad of pathfinders throughout the entire game. Pathfinders are an amazing unit that, while fragile, can snipe models below 40% HP. Upgraded with BAR's that process is expedited.They also have excellent sight range and at vet 3 synergize well with Jacksons and Scotts, acting as a spotter for them.

Soviet player lays 0 mines or demos the whole game.

If you hadn't thrown that grenade at 15:04 you would have beaten those Jagers if you took cover on the other side of the truck. Jagers are very squishy.

Neither one of you recrewed that abandoned Ost mortar. In general as the Allies, always steal the Germans' stuff. MG-42's, Mortars, PaK 40's, basically everything they drop. It's almost always worth it.

The Jackson assault at ~23 min was needless. Never lead with the squishy US TD's. That's why infantry support (or a Pathfinder spotter) is so vital. Abuse that range!

The 120mm mortar gets decrewed and killed because it's unguarded. Hell, even a US fighting position with a .50 would have been sufficient.

The KT takedown was great, good use of Mark Target by your teammate and a good flank by you.

By 28 minutes your teammate is floating 1000 (!) Manpower. I understand he wants T-34-85's, but they only cost 740. Again, a fuel cache would have been a good idea.

At 30 min, the Axis West flank is covered by one MG-42. Always try to flank/decap their units. They vast majority of their forces were in the middle or in the East.

Instead of a 3rd Para squad, consider an M8 Scott instead. It would have helped a lot with the Axis blobs, especially in pairs (fuel caches). They are excellent at wiping mortars, PaK's, MG's, and infantry hordes.

At 32:36 your teammate's Vet 3 sniper gets killed because he was alone and unsupported against an OKW blob.

Once the Tiger Ace came out, he (very stupidly) charged into your base. He lost his P4, and you decided to chase. Bad idea. You had no infantry support or any way of knowing what was on the other side (PaK's supporting infantry). This resulted in a lost SU-85 and a heavily damaged T-45-85.

You lost your Jackson (the Vet 0) because it was too close to the battle. Your LT could have easily cleared out the PaK, swinging the tide in your favor in a slugging match at that point.

That's all I got.

At the end of it all, I'd say what hampered you guys most was MP float and no fuel caches. 2 Scotts with a Pathfinder spotter would have wiped all the Ost team weapons and mopped the floor with the OKW blob, giving you free reign. When fighting Axis late-game tanks, it is critical to separate them from their supporting infantry and team weapons.

I hope this helped, feel free to ask any further questions.

First of all, you played with an eff'ing newbie. Second of all, I'm pretty sure that he lost the match for you after a few times of brief competency.

I do have some questions where I'd like people's opinions. With everyone getting CAS lately, I've been playing a lot of Guard Motor since B4's or ML-20's are now hard countered most of the time.

1) I haven't been building the scout car because CAS greatly helps with munitions so the scout car often gets fausted if grenadiers are present. Do other people play this way or do the build the scout car anyway?

2) I usually build 3 penals and 2 guards, then either a sniper or rocket truck. What do most people build for infantry? Do they get any anti-tank guns? What tiers?

3) I often end up floating a lot of manpower and fuel while either at 70 pop cap or waiting for the CP's to be able to bring in the T34's. I'm always hesitant to build something knowing that I'll have to lose it in order to bring in the tanks.

4) I usually save munitions for mark target, and occasionally for button if someone gets too aggressive. Would it be better to just lay mines?

First of all, you played with an eff'ing newbie. Second of all, I'm pretty sure that he lost the match for you after a few times of brief competency.

I do have some questions where I'd like people's opinions. With everyone getting CAS lately, I've been playing a lot of Guard Motor since B4's or ML-20's are now hard countered most of the time.

1) I haven't been building the scout car because CAS greatly helps with munitions so the scout car often gets fausted if grenadiers are present. Do other people play this way or do the build the scout car anyway?

2) I usually build 3 penals and 2 guards, then either a sniper or rocket truck. What do most people build for infantry? Do they get any anti-tank guns? What tiers?

3) I often end up floating a lot of manpower and fuel while either at 70 pop cap or waiting for the CP's to be able to bring in the T34's. I'm always hesitant to build something knowing that I'll have to lose it in order to bring in the tanks.

4) I usually save munitions for mark target, and occasionally for button if someone gets too aggressive. Would it be better to just lay mines?

Guards are crap atm. Pure cons is always effective with a couple penals if you need them or T2 for Maxims/AT. It's been a while since I watched that replay, but I'm pretty sure you only spammed guards and floated 1000 MP at one point. Caches man, caches.

Even if Wehr goes CAS, he still needs 3 CP to use the transfer ability. Plus, you can always use the M3 on the OKW side of the map. He will have nothing to stop it especially if you pop a flamer squad in there.

Mines, mines, mines, and demos. In all honesty, it's easier to kill tanks when they can barely move that once they're marked. Demos can easily wipe blobs. Plant them at choke points (i.e river crossings, the center VP, you get the idea).

Mines, mines, mines, and demos. In all honesty, it's easier to kill tanks when they can barely move that once they're marked. Demos can easily wipe blobs. Plant them at choke points (i.e river crossings, the center VP, you get the idea).

And put a mine on top of it. the mine will set off the demo. The only "downside" is it will get triggered by tanks too, but then again it will do a lot of damage.

I appreciate all of the replies and helpful suggestions. I'd say, the biggest thing for me is judging whether or not I will win an engagement.

As Australian Magic pointed out in the actual replay thread, he said we didn't communicate. We were on Teamspeak together but didn't talk as much as I'd like. I think it was late (around midnight) and we/I was just tired. If I would've gotten a Sherman instead of a Jackson, or if Newbie would've gotten a Katyusha and I a Jackson, things may have turned out different.

Honestly, I was expecting panthers from the Ostheer player, not stalling for a Tiger Ace... that seemed awfully silly (yet it worked).

We just didn't work together or coordinate well enough after early game, I think.

I appreciate all of the replies and helpful suggestions. I'd say, the biggest thing for me is judging whether or not I will win an engagement.

As Australian Magic pointed out in the actual replay thread, he said we didn't communicate. We were on Teamspeak together but didn't talk as much as I'd like. I think it was late (around midnight) and we/I was just tired. If I would've gotten a Sherman instead of a Jackson, or if Newbie would've gotten a Katyusha and I a Jackson, things may have turned out different.

Honestly, I was expecting panthers from the Ostheer player, not stalling for a Tiger Ace... that seemed awfully silly (yet it worked).

We just didn't work together or coordinate well enough after early game, I think.

Tiger Ace stall is the ost meta atm.

This map is a chaos, should be removed

it is the game extender map Kappa

This map is a chaos, should be removed

+1

It's like Age of Empire's where you build a little town with walls and make a pretty fort.

Awful map. If I wanted to bomb something all day I'd join the Air force.

This map is a chaos, should be removed

it is the game extender map Kappa

+1

It's like Age of Empire's where you build a little town with walls and make a pretty fort.

Awful map. If I wanted to bomb something all day I'd join the Air force.

I miss Hochwald Gap

Guards are crap atm. Pure cons is always effective with a couple penals if you need them or T2 for Maxims/AT. It's been a while since I watched that replay, but I'm pretty sure you only spammed guards and floated 1000 MP at one point. Caches man, caches.

Even if Wehr goes CAS, he still needs 3 CP to use the transfer ability. Plus, you can always use the M3 on the OKW side of the map. He will have nothing to stop it especially if you pop a flamer squad in there.

Mines, mines, mines, and demos. In all honesty, it's easier to kill tanks when they can barely move that once they're marked. Demos can easily wipe blobs. Plant them at choke points (i.e river crossings, the center VP, you get the idea).

Guards are crap Kappa

Guards are crap Kappa

Pre-patch Keepo

I appreciate all of the replies and helpful suggestions. I'd say, the biggest thing for me is judging whether or not I will win an engagement.

As Australian Magic pointed out in the actual replay thread, he said we didn't communicate. We were on Teamspeak together but didn't talk as much as I'd like. I think it was late (around midnight) and we/I was just tired. If I would've gotten a Sherman instead of a Jackson, or if Newbie would've gotten a Katyusha and I a Jackson, things may have turned out different.

Honestly, I was expecting panthers from the Ostheer player, not stalling for a Tiger Ace... that seemed awfully silly (yet it worked).

We just didn't work together or coordinate well enough after early game, I think.

That loss was my fault, it was late and I was tired and not playing well. Wasted a sniper, was sure that one of their squads was going to get wiped before it could get my 120, but lost the 120 to them. That was huge, because it started the manpower bleed going the other way.

Guards are crap Kappa

They were mostly crap, but were helpful in stopping the fast Luchs. Now they're pretty good except that they like to drop weapons way too much.

I miss Hochwald Gap

Relic should bring it back under "Hakovskiya". Fun, fun map.