Upcoming Mod - Balance feedback please

Asterisks (*) denote currently implemented changes

Everything is subject to change. Please provide constructive criticism!

Global

(*)All LMGs have 1.05 incremental accuracy except for LMG42 which has 1.1

(*)All HMGs capture rate and decap rate to 0.65 and 0.6 respectively

(*)Shreck long accuracy decreased by 0.01, long aim time increased by 0.5

(*)10% deflection damage on all AT guns

()Slightly increase grenade scatter and reduce range when suppressed (0.5, 33%?)

(*)Tank traps have 55 extra HP (from 500) and can be crushed by heavy tanks

Wehr

(*)Grenadiers get Shreck for 65 MU after BP1 upgrade, get assault gren model at Vet 2

(*)Pgrens gain 1 man at Vet 2, small Vet requirement increase.

(*)Wehr Scout Car MP increased by 10, armor increased by 5.

(*)MG42 MP increased by 10, incremental accuracy increased by 0.15, nearby suppression increased by 0.05

(*)All battle phase costs reduced by 5 fuel and 20 MP

AEF

(*)0.50 cal penetration doubled, damage decreased by 2, cost increased to 300 MP, added 5th man, added Single Fire ability, setup to 3.2 and teardown to 2.10, accuracy increased by 0.1, suppression increased by 0.02, Vet 1 decreased by 20 pts

(*)Rear Echelon get cover accuracy bonus like Osttruppen

()Paradrop gives 2 squads for 400 MP 10 FU

(*)Paratroopers get 1x Zooka for 50 MU

(*)Zooka pen increased by 10, gets chance for crew stun crit

OKW

()Volks Shreck upgrade gives +4 MP cost and -10% Vet gain (give MP40s and Panzerfaust instead?)

(*)All OKW HQ buildings cost increased by 100 MP.

(*)Decrease penetration of Flak HQ to (20,35,45) from (45,45,45), decrease area suppression to 0.6 from 0.8

(*)Add 5 FU to Forward Retreat Point (270 MP, 20 MU, 5 FU)

(*)Raketenwerfer near aim time multiplier decreased by 0.1, near accuracy increased by 0.5, max ready_aim_time decreased by 0.1

(*)Added 3-man Panzerjaeger squad (210 MP) with 2 Shrecks

(*)Change LMG34 damage from 8 to 4.5, increased Obersoldaten entity accuracy to 1.3

Soviets

(*)Increased Maxim MP cost by 3, removed 1 man

(*)Decreased all HQ buildings by 5 fuel and 10 MP

(*)Conscripts get 1 DP upgrade for 60 MU

()Conscripts get 1 man and PPSH at Vet 3

(*)Penals get Commisar at Vet 2 (82 HP), Vet 2 increase to 1120 (40 pt increase), long-fuse grenade assault ability

()Reduce PTRS drop rate

(*)All LMGs have 1.05 incremental accuracy except for LMG42 which has 1.1

so lmgs should be morea accurate?

anyways i consider ur balance suggestions/mod as not good.

(*)All LMGs have 1.05 incremental accuracy except for LMG42 which has 1.1

so lmgs should be morea accurate?

Incremental accuracy increases accuracy when more targets are present, so they're better at killing blobs now. Units with LMGs have a better chance against blobs, and blobs using LMGs against smaller numbers of units won't have that extra accuracy.

anyways i consider ur balance suggestions/mod as not good.

Could you elaborate?

Interesting changes, but it would serious playtesting to validate it.

Thanks for your efforts.

(*)Grenadiers get Shreck for 65 MU after BP1 upgrade, get assault gren model at Vet 2

Voted this is bullsh*t after reading it.

Voted this is bullsh*t after reading it.

I forgot to mention it disables the Faust, but I guess it's too little too late. I'm not some balance guru, that's why I wanted constructive criticism.

Having schrecks on main line infantry is not a good idea as okw clearly demonstrates. I see what you're trying to do: provide a answer to fast m20s, but this seems like the wrong avenue to take.

Lmgs already overperform in my view (sniping mgs and other weapon crews), the proposed change would only make matters worse and would potentially even buff lmg blobs, if they face a lot of units (even if they're microed and not a moved further punishing the player which makes an effort).

I like the changes, but two of them stand out to me. So that paradrop ability from that specific commander gives two squads for 400 man power and 10 fuel? Does it still drop the AT gun? That's pretty cheap nonetheless! And what's the reason for giving grens a shrek? So they can have shreks and their lmg upgrade at the same time? anti everything unit.

I forgot to mention it disables the Faust, but I guess it's too little too late. I'm not some balance guru, that's why I wanted constructive criticism.

Veterancy disables one of the abilities? You don't even deserve constructive critism, really.

Grenaiders should have 5 models at vet 2, but why conscripts shouldn't have additional shocktrooper model.

Veterancy disables one of the abilities? You don't even deserve constructive critism, really.

Out of the 29 changes, you single this out? I don't deserve constructive criticism because of 1 change? What do I deserve then? I was talking about the Shreck upgrade, not a Vet 2 bonus. Would you want one Grenadier to disable and quickly kill your T-34 or Jackson?

So... LMG blobbing is discouraged by encouraging LMG blobbing?

....

You should put a small description and reasoning for every change. Because quite honestly, pretty much none of them makes any sense.

So... LMG blobbing is discouraged by encouraging LMG blobbing?

....

Not intentionally. There could be a cost increase, say +10 MU.

Here's an explanation of incremental accuracy:
http://hq-coh.com/stats/coh-stats.com/Info_Accuracy_Increment.html

there is a diff from balancing the game and reworking the game.

Incremental accuracy doesn't work when we have several factions with different number of models.

Ex: 3 Obers (blob) are treated equally to 2 conscripts.

-.-.-.-.-.-.-
(*)Grenadiers get Shreck for 65 MU after BP1 upgrade, get assault gren model at Vet 2
(*)Pgrens gain 1 man at Vet 2, small Vet requirement increase.
...
and so on

Big nope, nope.
-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Either you explain the reason behind your changes, intended behaviour AND or result of your changes.

There are some "acceptable" changes but there are big NO on the list.

Incremental accuracy increases accuracy when more targets are present, so they're better at killing blobs now. Units with LMGs have a better chance against blobs, and blobs using LMGs against smaller numbers of units won't have that extra accuracy.


Could you elaborate?

LMGs are already the best upgrade (Obers, LMG grens, Airbornes/riflemen with double m1919). Increasing the accuracy vs blobs will make them even more viable than they are already.

Giving Cons a pshh vet rather makes them worse. since they already perform good at close range, so u basically just steal some of their mid-long range dps. It Also overlaps with the doctrinal upgrade.

OWK doesn't need a dedicated at squad. 3 man squads are supper squishy anyways. Almost impossible to preserve veterancy on them. Volks can keep their schrecks, just redesign their insane veterancy boni and not the veterancy speed, since -10% won't affect them much anyways.

(*)Shreck long accuracy decreased by 0.01, long aim time increased by 0.5
(*)Grenadiers get Shreck for 65 MU after BP1 upgrade, get assault gren model at Vet 2

why nerf panzergrenadiers?

Overall you are changing stuff without fixing the actuall problem of the current meta game.

1. Overperforming Call In Spam (IS2/t34/85) followed by Ostheer always getting Tiger.
2. Overperforming veterancy units: volks and obers. (Those units determine okw late game)
3. Unfair early game Ostheer/USF setup. (Ostheer struggles over the control of the battlefield due to heavy manpower disadvantage in teching.

there is a diff from balancing the game and reworking the game.

For the 1000th time, this. These changes look cool on paper, but they are not gonna happen.
First of all there are a lot easier changes Relic can do, which has been discussed before. Reworking factions a unlikely and I'm sure that they will cause a lot more balance problems.

Some small issues with these changes:

- LMG change are not gonna help people deal with blobs, its gonna persuade them even more.
- vCoH tank traps? no thank you. This way poor USF can do nothing, but the glorious panthers and tigers will troll around the map
- changing core infantry like that, specially for Ostheer is a bad bad idea. Grens are helpless early, but turning them into volks is not gonna be of any help.
- 10 Fuel and second para squad? Want some fries with that?
- Soviets do need better line infantry late game, but they already have enough CQC capabilities, giving Cons PPSH is not gonna be a good Idea
-etc. etc.

Again, these changes might, or might not work. Test them as a mod, why the hell not. But even if they turn out fine, DO NOT expect Relic to implement them, or even consider them because of:
- They are taking their time for the slightest changes, reworking the game like this is too much resource intensive and is very very unlikely
- More importantly, the game does not need drastic changes. Maybe a few OKW adjustments, the rest can be easily fixed with simple nerfs and buffs. These kind of changes will make things worse.

- More importantly, the game does not need drastic changes. Maybe a few OKW adjustments, the rest can be easily fixed with simple nerfs and buffs. These kind of changes will make things worse.

I disagree to some extend, while most units are indeed fine and other need only a slight adjustment, major problems like the Call In Meta, which kills the diversity of the game/viable strategies, are not fixed by simple nerfs and buffs.

I disagree to some extend, while most units are indeed fine and other need only a slight adjustment, major problems like the Call In Meta, which kills the diversity of the game/viable strategies, are not fixed by simple nerfs and buffs.

They will be fixed good sir. As Soviets, imagine if SU85 was viable, would you still wait for T34/85? Simple nerfs like increasing CP and/or cost, and on the other hand a simple price reduction for buildings, everything would change.

I have to clarify though, "the call in meta" by itself ids not a bad thing! By changing the meta, some people aim to completely eradicate the call-in. Well that's not gonna happen. This is called having a lot of viable options. The thing is that call-ins are abused. They are far cheaper than teching. So, "simply" nerfing them a bit, and buffing core units would change things in a good way. But if you are trying to totally destroy call-ins and turn them to some useless units, that's bad.

too bland for a mod too unlikely for a balance patch