Vehicle crits

I've brought this up a couple of times before, but the crit system for vehicles seriously needs some tweaking, bad dice rolls affect the gameplay to a huge degree right now and that is not interesting for either side.

Ubiquitous infantry antivehicle snares should NOT have any chance to give a heavy engine crit to a healthy vehicle. If you seriously want to include a heavy engine crit component on these, make it a conditional on the targeted vehicle already having an engine damaged critical. The current 95:5 vehicle damage:vehicle destroyed chance is an example of the worst RNG design you can get, a huge reward for a small chance on an often used ability.

For mines, the situation is better, but frankly gameplay would still be improved if engine destroyed criticals could only be received when vehicle health was below some threshold like say 66%, rather than always occuring at a 66:33 ratio like right now.

Abandon is pretty much just as bad as the engine destroyed crits from vehicle snares. As I assume it is not going to be removed from the game (which would be the simplest fair solution), work should be done to make it more predictable so that there are ways other than "not losing vehicles" to mitigate it. For instance, you could: only enable it on rear armor shots, or tie abandonment chance to the type of criticals it has received with a non-crit state being 0% abandon chance.

And lastly but not least: receiving criticals should NOT let a vehicle always survive. Damage should not be negated in any way by receiving criticals. Vehicles should not be staying alive at 5% health while receiving tons of damage just because their main gun makes the ultimate sacrifice.

TL;DR:

1. Remove 5% vehicle destroyed crit from atnades/faust
2. Make engine destroyed on mines only happen on vehicles that are below x% health
3. Modify abandon rules to make it a more interesting system than a flat 5% chance always
4. Receiving crits still kills the vehicle (except abandon)

Abandoned should also destroy the engine and tracks.

agreed that destroyed enging never should happend on a atnade and faust. it is just stupid that a atnade or faust can almost doom a vehicle by giving it destroyed enging.

Not that you didn't explain what you were saying in an understandable manner, but the wording you used seems to leave some other possibilities open.

M20 mines: they don't do engine damage. They do a ton of health damage and immobilize. Does that fit into the category of destroyed engine(because it's worse, technically).

I feel like some of this I'm in agreement with, but I feel like point 2 needs to be elaborated on. Like what exactly is supposed to happen when a tank runs over a mine now? It just gets some health damage and keeps on going with no crit? Does every mine do regular engine?

I divide the mines in my mind into 3 categories (could be 2). tm-35 and schu-mines are very similar and seems to do the same crit engine damage. m20 mines and teller mines(reigels too, I guess, really don't understand the point of them) might as well both cause immobilization, since you hardly go anywhere with destroyed engine.

If it's running over mines and not getting a crit, I don't really support it, unless the chance is really small. This has been foundational since day1 coh1. You run over a trap, you get screwed over. I really don't even like the little mines some USF infantry can place. You can place 30 mu worth, have something run over it, and do less damage and no crit compared to a tm-35. It sounds like bringing that to the other mines and that would really suck to me.

M20 mines: they don't do engine damage. They do a ton of health damage and immobilize. Does that fit into the category of destroyed engine(because it's worse, technically).

M20 mines (and axis Riegel mines of which they are an almost exact copy) are guaranteed to work, there is no RNG involved. They are not particularly spammable due to vehicle laying and higher pricepoint, so I do not see any issue with these gameplay wise.

I feel like some of this I'm in agreement with, but I feel like point 2 needs to be elaborated on. Like what exactly is supposed to happen when a tank runs over a mine now? It just gets some health damage and keeps on going with no crit? Does every mine do regular engine?

Always engine damage, I want to reduce RNG, not increase it by suddenly giving a chance to get away with running over mines scot-free. No engine destroyed on your tank from running over a regular (ie. tm35/schu/teller) mine at full health, engine destroyed chance atleast as high as the current 33% if you run over them at lower health.

I haven't looked at the crit stats, but I know that I've never seen any tank get a destroyed engine from a tm-35. It's possible I'm paying more attention to destroying it any cost and not checking it though. With a 33% chance I should have encountered it already.

Every mine does a regular "engine". don't you guys mean damage?

I agree with Vaz, if you spend munitions on a mine, with the intent to catch a tank in a trap, then thats good strategy, mines are fine as they are now.

AT nades however are simply a get out of jail free card. Your tank takes 90% damage, opponents tank chases and all you have to do is faust or at nade it, and its out of the fight.

And also, what player just cruises around in a damaged tank? 90-95% of all mine hits would be on full health tanks who just hit a mine at full health, then take a AT gun hit, then back up. So mines only getting crits on damaged armour would almost never happen

well cruzz clarified my questions and it sounds good to me. No getting away scott free. If I understand right, no change to any 60mu mines. This would pretty much just affect Soviet and OKW.

guys, it's not that hard.

brand new, factory candy paint tank

infantry snare: 80 damage, engine damage

riegel/made-in-america(tm): 400 damage, immobilized (not sure why they have immobilized and engine destroyed, the outcome is the same)

teller: 500, engine damage

tm-35/asian mine: 200 damage, engine damage


field applied camo and bullet decals tank:

infantry snare: 80 damage, engine damage

riegel/made-in-america(tm): 400 damage, immobilized

teller: 500, engine damage, maybe engine destroyed

tm-35/asian mine: 200 damage, engine damage, maybe engine destroyed



i think it would be worth looking into a light/medium/heavy engine damage. a faust, for example, would do light engine damage (medium on damaged tank) and mines medium (heavy on a damaged tank). the idea with light damage is that the tank isn't almost certainly fucked like they are right now with engine damage and to give people an incentive to wait before fisting. i'm not sure anything causes heavy damage right now other than bad luck and there isn't a light damage that i know of.

I see you lost it after our last engagement. Keepo
However, I do believe this issue is ridiculous and should be fixed immediately, so..........+1

I see you lost it after our last engagement. Keepo
However, I do believe this issue is ridiculous and should be fixed immediately, so..........+1

Yes, the motivation to make this post was that. But I've complained about it in a bunch of posts before too, and I do think pretty much everyone decent considers these things #esports.

I want that 5% chance of engine destroyed on ubiquitous AT abilities gone as well. It's bullshit, end of story.

Yes, less RNG is always good. Really support your suggestions.

Copy from another thread.
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RNG: i think that there are some things which would be better to put some limits on, not just eliminate them.

Heavy engine damage: only ocurring with things such as mines or ram (from behind) on little chance. Snares may only have a chance of getting it when there is light engine damage involve already.

Abandoned vehicles: maybe should have some crit by default, such as light, heavy or inmobilize.

Dead crits (light/heavy/main gun): i think that OVERKILLS should really destroy a vehicle. Anything that deals +160 damage over the health of a tank or anything that deals +80 damage over a light vehicle (M3, 221, 250, Kubel, etc.).
Example:
-This means that at 0 health, you shouldn't be getting situation on which you receive main gun destroy > light engine damage > heavy engine damage > abandoned > death.
-160 damage is what most sources of AT deals. This means that heavy hitters such as vehicles that deal 240, 320, SturmTiger and Artillery/Offmaps would get a guaranteed kill if the vehicle is at low health.

Also, certain light vehicles should have their main gun destroyed replaced by gunner killed such as the M3 or Kubel.

re: AT Snares - agree: engine damage should not occur if vehicle health = 100% at time of attack.
re: mines - disagree: I should be rewarded for smart mine placement, consider most mines are in my friendly territory so if a tank is that far into my region he should be punished by good mine placement
5% crit change - agree: this is just stupid and needs to be changed/fixed.