vCoH US - what do I do wrong ?

AvNY, yeah I know pepsi is one of the best in CoH. Heard about him ^^

Pepsi, I'll try the building trick. But I thought the only way to exit buildings was to click the button and where they exit is up to RNG gods.

Fanatic, The unit description of the M18 Hellcat says it's faster and better armored than the M10. Is that wrong then?

AvNY, yeah I know pepsi is one of the best in CoH. Heard about him ^^

Pepsi, I'll try the building trick. But I thought the only way to exit buildings was to click the button and where they exit is up to RNG gods.

Fanatic, The unit description of the M18 Hellcat says it's faster and better armored than the M10. Is that wrong then?

When you click on a building you get see the units. Click on the unit and when you click to "exit" the cursor becomes a little box with a down arrow. That will tell the unloading unit where to go and it will exit via the closest exit in the building.

There is a youtube tutorial on it somewhere but in a quick search I was unable to find it.

Hey,

I got some time to watch two of your replays (the first two), ill start with the one against "dutchdefense".

00:10- (small thing) the engineer should go to the right to cap the munitions and then the fuel, the second engineer starts building the barracks but doesn't finish and swaps with the 3rd engineer you built (this in a three engineer start), the 2nd engineer that stopped building goes for the manpower point to connect the fuel that the 1st engineer should be capping.
01:25- don't cap the vp's early, the fuel is much better.
02:00- don't use wire on yellow cover, plus you got your engineers stuck, I don't even know how you managed that.
02:10-don't do jeep with a three engineer start, since this start is already weak you need rifles, I would suggest 3 rifles and tech to either wsc (for snipers) or fast m8. Alternatively if you feel comfortable flanking then 4 rifles bars and upgrade flamers on your engineers.
2:50- (small thing) don't try to fight if you aren't going to win, if it was me I would straight up move the engineer to the fuel more on the right instead of not doing anything and taking the volks damage.
05:40- don't blob your rifles against WM, or you can get both squads supressed.
around 6 to 7 minutes- use your jeep to scout his base, if you know whats coming you can counter much easily.
12:20- don't run into the WM territory with the rifles like that, at that point he's already well set up, its better for you to keep the rifles at distance while the snipers shoot away, also by this point the infantry doctrine should be a no brainer.
20:00- in a game where he camped an area for some time you have to expect it to be mined, your sherman should be used to go around the "wings" of the map denying him his fuel and keeping him contained until you get the howitzer. This is the best way to fight that strategy on langres.
21:20- waste of 150 manpower to do the medic thing.
22:20- don't do machine gun emplacements they are just not worth it, especially against gren blobs with shrecks
23:55- again don't run rifles into his territory.
24:30- you should go for the m10 or m18 right after you see the puma.
26:00- just a reminder that you have 500 munitions, this could be munitions that could have won the game by now if you had used them on artillery strikes, for example when running the rifles into the mg.
The rest of the game was a slow skirmish win after win to the WM player, so Im just doing to say my final thoughts, don't go for armor doctrine, it comes too late to take effect on the bunker strategy he's using, after 3 cps you should already know what to use which should be the infantry doctrine so you can keep the pressure and actually go into his territory without the fear of the mgs, since you didn't pick it you lost A LOT of manpower rushing in with rifles without no real purpose, I also wouldn't recommend going for tank depot AT ALL without going infantry doctrine to clear the paks, especially considering that if you use the resources that you used for the tank depot to build a howitzer it would be much better and would open a door for you to build a motor pool later on for the stugs and KT.

next game:
00:00-02:00- same thing of last game (regarding the jeep and the vp cap).
02:00- look for the pioneers to kill no the volks.
04:50- as soon as you see this bunker you either rush m8 or go for the snipers.
05:25- rebuilding the jeep is a big no no.
Overall bad engagements for some time that put you on the back foot, you have to know when to retreat right away.
12:00- when you are that far behind get 2 snipers, you need a way not to lose manpower while draining him and then go for motor pool for AT.
Last thoughts, pick your fights right is half of how to play US, in my eyes you lose too much manpower and then the manpower you do have you do the wrong choices, you also seem not to have much idea when to be agressive and when to be passive, it's hard for me to explain this last bit since you have different timers to be agressive and passive depending on the build order you did or in what you plan to do, either way for the three rifles sniper opening you should be passive with the 3 rifles early on (mostly fighting in the wings of the map and not doing blunt engagements against the full german force, and be agressive when you get the sniper in conjunction with some flamer upgrades.

Hope this helped, any question you have ill try to answer.

You have hit the jackpot with this thread, Campaigner - I hope it encourages others to seek advice

Fanatic, The unit description of the M18 Hellcat says it's faster and better armored than the M10. Is that wrong then?

Not sure about the armour but the M18 is never faster then the M10.

@DevM

Hey,

I got some time to watch two of your replays (the first two), ill start with the one against "dutchdefense".

Hope this helped, any question you have ill try to answer.

It does!

However, Wehr isn't THAT hard to deal with. It's PE who just rolls me. Their Elf play (strike hard and fast) is really hard to handle. Makes ATguns useless. I just don't know what to do against them....Thinking of unticking Lowlands cause that map is an automatic loss vs PE....No idea what to do on that map....
Then again Angoville is also impossible to defeat PE on....


I tried four Rifles but it's so hard to control so many squads together with the engis :/ So much switching back'n'forth....
I normally use 1-3=Rifles, 4=vehicle, 5=sniper, 6=Mortar, 9=artillery. Thinking of quitting that since I lose track of units if I get more riflesquads (medic tent).


http://www.coh2.org/file/6178/close-vs-wehr.rec <--- Close game. He wasn't that good but I couldn't beat it.
It's always the same problem. I have to defend ATguns and I lose....

http://www.coh2.org/file/6179/impossible-pe.rec <--- By the time I get an M8, he got schrecks. By the time I got an Atgun, he got Panther Battlegroup(!)

I go for some VP far away, Mr.Armored Car comes and shoots me up. Sometimes the blob comes....Anywhere I don't have ATguns, two Panthers come along and say hello...
It's kinda gotten to the point where I'm thinking of trying brits instead. Got better AT....

I've watched Inverse's two videos about the matchup where you just go infantry and no vehicles and it seems that is what I have to do. Infantry + ATguns....

At the moment I cant watch the replays but I dont think I need to watch them to help you out against PE since the answer is really simple. The way to beat PE with US is to blob the riflemen, to do this you just go for the triage center and upgrade bars, you will be able to destroy anything PE throws at you and you can get the m8/at gun later on. This works because PE is mostly composed by light vehicels that get easily damaged by bars, a rifle in green cover will always beat the scoutcar no matter what. As for the Angoville map you just do the same thing but keep your blob in between cut offs.

I hate playing PE so much. It's taken me at least 150 games to finally start figuring them out. I can beat wehr 2 levs higher than me, but I lose to PE 2 levs lower than me.

DevM has great thread on GR about jeep open and 3 rifle start and rush to m8. I find this is the best tactic. I like it better than aimstrong bullet proof because jeep allows you to chase kettens and helps you win early fights.

but, what I've learned so far. you cannot lose any unit in first 10 minutes, inlcuding engy. If you lose a squad even though you may kill 2 of his, you are behind. Learn the retreat paths because your full health full squad will die on retreat to ACs, PG blobs, etc. Focus fire. It makes a huge difference. Once you have enough AT to hold off AC rush, get snipers. Once you kill ketten, get some mines. Dont fight unless you are triple sure you will win. If he goes for your cutoff, don't fight, go for his.

This has helped me be competitive at least with my same lev, but trust me, I still dread seeing PE on load up screen. I know one day, it will all click, as I know once you're pro, beating PE is pretty easy. But some of the cheesy stuff they can pull off, esp with scorch earth is frustrating until you can figure it out.

Answered a few of your questions but too lazy to take quotes from all the different places.

-Should you get all buildings? Depends. In long games you should ALWAYS have AT guns, do not rely solely on handheld AT or tanks in really long games because its easy to adapt to those by massing Paks Shreks or good infantry killing units. WSC is good to have eventually, but if your Rifles are scaling very well with lots of veterancy you may not need them. I don't usually throw up a late T4 unless its to deal with heavy T3 play or a pesky Ostwinds or Pumas that keep evading my AT guns. Getting fast Shermans is good in some situations especially on Sturzdorf, but getting late Shermans after you already had a T3 up is a pretty weak tech move imo.

-Armor is a bit of a novelty doctrine vs Wehrmacht unless you are trying to do some Silence T17 spam strat you're going to have a bad time because Calliopes are inferior compared to 105mm and come later, also the Pershing underperforms a bit for a heavy tank. Armor is decent against PE though. Airborne is good for a few things. Good for dealing with Sniper spam and huge blob play obviously. Also decent against Stugs and Stuhs. Not so good vs mass Pumas since they miss a lot. Infantry is usually the best option BUT if you are playing vs a heavy T3 player avoid howitzer unless Nebels are getting really annoying because artillery is not the answer to a highly mobile unit composition. And do not use Rangers as your main AT against Pumas because they will get kited and chewed the fuck up, instead use ATGs or M10s and use Rangers more as a finisher unit on damaged Pumas that are trying to get away so that do not risk your M10s or ATG moving them up too far.

-Focus more on mechanics than meta strat at this point in time. Once you've gotten better about the flanking and idle units then incorporate new opening build orders but until then I recommend 2eng 4rifle since experimenting with new playstyles won't solve anything if you are still struggling with mechanical problems (bad flanks and multitasking). Not saying that 2E4R is the all time strongest build order, but if you aren't already playing at a high level that is not the most important refinements you should be making at this time. I guess a good analogy in golf terms would be not to spend big bucks on the top of the line equipment before you can swing properly and strike the ball well on most shots.

we need a mentor for this guy

which language u speak??

coh is verry hard 2 understand when u not have a mentor
an excample is me ok i`m not a pro but i understand the game
and without the work from RoM irondragon and Endeffektdelirium i would be a big noob

i can say 1 thing whatch replays all replays from the frontline networks and inverse this can help u much


when pe get only blob no ac`s its a free win u need only many flamers a bit micro that u loose no units
tech 2 shermans and micro them well get a heal asap and when u not need a strafe then do tank doc 2 shermans and hellcats
the best vs a blob is a calli or 2 shermans and a pershing
but dont loose any of ur units!!!!!!!!!!!!!thats verry important !!!!!!!!!!

I'm not completely new or so. I have been playing since 2011 but that was mostly teamgames with IRL friends (which I didn't like, I preferred 1v1)

It goes better now. It has changed in that PE is the easy to defeat faction now and Wehr became the hard one (mines....everywhere....)

Nekron,

Swedish and english


Good PE players focus on flamers (Gewehr 43 = brutal!) so it's hard to keep things alive. Now I try to bait his blob by making them chase a Riflesquad so I can strafe them and move in with everything I got. That gives them two choices: Retreat or die!


DevM,

Fast BARs might be useful but all US players on Complexitys stream goes 2x M8s against him. I've learned more about the matchup though, adapt better and it goes well now =)


Basilone,

Speaking of heavy T3, faced a Wehr on Sturzdorf who went heavy on Stugs and mines. Couldn't do so much about him :/

http://www.coh2.org/file/6246/heavy-t3-wehr-smashed-me.rec

Basilone,

Speaking of heavy T3, faced a Wehr on Sturzdorf who went heavy on Stugs and mines. Couldn't do so much about him :/

http://www.coh2.org/file/6246/heavy-t3-wehr-smashed-me.rec

I watched up until 18 minutes because you had pretty much already lost the game at that point so I won't focus on stuff that happens when you were already in an almost certain unwinnable position.

First thing I didn't like was cap order. What I do every single time on Sturzdorf is send one engineer to focus left side and the other caps the right side. Left side engineer usually will be forced off the fuel after securing the nearby stuff that is normal because most Wehr players will go left rather than stretching really thin right. Right side engineer can get the whole bottom/top right corner of the map without being interrupted unless a bike goes straight for him. First rifle grabs the muni point outside the base to the right (+5 on top side, +10 bottom) and cap walks to the high fuel point- this is the best capwalking map in the game imo. When you are bottom you can also cap walk the +10 fuel in the northeast corner, but when you are top side just leave that point for your engineer because you want your rifle at the +16 asap. What second rifle does depends on opponents actions and you cannot script for that. If no resistance right side then use your next rifles and your engineers (usually your left one will have been retreated by this point) to finish getting the right and middle area. Do keep some units especially a flamer close to the middle so you can quickly react if he makes a move for your cutoff, don't position all your stuff too far north. Wehrmacht tends to be less aggressive towards your cutoff when you are on the top side but don't get caught with your pants down trying some 4 rifles in the bottom of the map nonsense.

Next problem was Jeep start. Don't push his MGs early like that, not only did you not succeed and take a ton of damage which led to some unnecessary repair time, but forcing a MG that deep in his territory to retreat like that does not accomplish much for you, he will be back with help in 10 seconds. Forcing all his pioneers to retreat instead makes a much bigger impact, you can set him back several minutes on resource income by doing that, also you force him to baby sit them with combat units in the future which can be very mentally taxing for weaker players. But in general I wouldn't recommend Jeeps on this map since the map design can be pretty limiting to vehicle micro and its very hard to push units out of the concrete wall cover compared to something like haystacks.

3rd problem: Late flamer, early minesweeper. You were in pretty defensive position for the first 5 minutes of the game which made getting the sweeper first pointless as a flamer can be used both offensively and defensively but a minesweeper isn't doing anything if you aren't proactively going in their territory to flank. Flamethrower should be used to help around the central building area if he has units there. When facing someone spamming mines really obnoxiously just run your sweeper through an area and shoot the mines with BAR squads, it is SO much faster than taking the time sweep every single one of them and lets you get some mines without moving in to his fields of fire. Just don't shoot the mines if your engineer is standing on it.

Last but not least was the choice to make 3 M8s. I think M8 is one of the weaker tech choices on this map, super high fuel map makes it better to either get rifle upgrades to tanks, or straight to tanks. The buildings and concrete walls on the right side make it difficult to be evasive around Paks and there are just too many great mine locations on this map. Not only was M8 in general a weak move but so was getting 3 of them. Get one M8. If you are facing a huge T1 either get a second one or follow your first one with some rifle upgrades or sniper. I don't think getting 3 is ever a good idea unless you are trolling some shitty PE player because its fairly obvious what you are doing at that point and M8s are a non issue when prepared for properly

In summary this stuff should help you contain Wehr to the left side most the time and give you the fuel advantage. Work on preserving rifles and not driving over obvious mine spots without mine/face sweeping it first.

Nekron,

Swedish and english


Good PE players focus on flamers (Gewehr 43 = brutal!) so it's hard to keep things alive. Now I try to bait his blob by making them chase a Riflesquad so I can strafe them and move in with everything I got. That gives them two choices: Retreat or die!


ok good i have 2 swedish mates i ask they for help maybe u can go with they on a team speak

yeah they have a g43 when they sit in grenn cover and wait not attack when u cant win
make a trap and let him come 2 u

excample: cap his fuel with 1 pio he need 2 come 2 u or he loose his fuel(when he sit at his fuel go 2 his cut off i hope u know what i mean)

when u attack let ur flamers behind ur inf or in ur inf
then is ur flamer hard 2 focus
use green cover or yellow cover on close(mid) range watch ur flamer ur flamer not a hero but they help u hard vs pe verry hard(elite armor)

i dont like heavy t3 vs pe
u do 2 m8`s he do atht`s
and when he have not 2 he wait in his base
u cant go in because of the flaks
paks are countered by mortar or hummel
and when u loose a fight and loose ur at guns
horrible time for u when a pe guy has 2 at guns

its not easy for us vs pe the first fight when a pe loose the fight then it is verry easy but mostly u loose the first fight...


i do vs pe asap heal! flamers and then t1 t4 stickis flank the acs like a mg dont loose 2 much menpower and buy from the t4 what u need (sherman when shreks hellcat when g43 and stg)
when he have only an atht use field repair put it on and drive over the pe and destroy so many u can and hold ur tanks alive!!!!

i can talk many more i can talk the hole day because it exist many strats vs pe
first i write my mate mellow maybe he can help u

You can add me on steam or skype. Steam: sebbe94320 Skype: sebastian.backlund

You can add me on steam or skype. Steam: sebbe94320 Skype: sebastian.backlund

i love the coh community sooo friendly

add mellow

Iam also searching for an mentor .

You can add me on steam or skype. Steam: sebbe94320 Skype: sebastian.backlund

Steam can't find you. It only finds people up til sebbe94. If I add the "3" it doesn't find anyone

Steam can't find you. It only finds people up til sebbe94. If I add the "3" it doesn't find anyone

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197987142337/

this is the link from mellow ;-) from his steam profile

http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197987142337/

this is the link from mellow ;-) from his steam profile

It doesn't help. There are 1500+ Mellow and looking through them all....

Tried going through FatalSaint but his profile is private so can't do that....


Tried to find myself and it works by current profile name but not with accountname....strange!

It doesn't help. There are 1500+ Mellow and looking through them all....

Tried going through FatalSaint but his profile is private so can't do that....


Tried to find myself and it works by current profile name but not with accountname....strange!

click on this link that is mellows steam profile and add him

or go over my profile: bynekron i have a pic from an old man they hold the world in his hands