but what if they kill the truck. is that a risk in itself?
multiple people have already answered this. yes it is a risk to lose the truck. it will delay teching.
OKW truck pushing
26 Aug 2014, 16:32 PM
#41
Posts: 950 | Subs: 1
multiple people have already answered this. yes it is a risk to lose the truck. it will delay teching.
26 Aug 2014, 16:38 PM
#42
Posts: 2070
i have only seen the strat on stream. i never see it on 4v4
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
26 Aug 2014, 16:39 PM
#43
Posts: 542
but what if they kill the truck. is that a risk in itself?
Yes, because you have to wait 3 more minutes until you get another truck, which you also have to drive into position first again... delays your tech a lot. Don't forget you cannot even throw grenades without a base building for example.
I still think the truck pushing is stupid and shouldn't happen, but personally I don't feel it is worth the risk either. Lowering the health on the truck just because of that I wouldn't like to see, as it is you can already lose your truck during building up to a single fast Scout car.
26 Aug 2014, 16:42 PM
#44
Posts: 896
Truck pushing is absolutely fine. The OKW player is taking a pretty big risk using it as a frontline unit. An M3 or that US jeep thing can kill it pretty quickly.
Hardly any, even facing a sov sc m3 start, most trucks make it back safe.
26 Aug 2014, 16:47 PM
#45
Posts: 2053
Most logical "nerf" would be to NOT make it spawn instantly.
26 Aug 2014, 16:50 PM
#46
Posts: 262
So why was katitof's suggestion to make damage carry over to the building dismissed?
I think he made it relatively clear that the okw truck != pioneers.
It sounds like a good compromise (as using the truck in this manner is already at risk to m3s and the like).
I think he made it relatively clear that the okw truck != pioneers.
It sounds like a good compromise (as using the truck in this manner is already at risk to m3s and the like).
26 Aug 2014, 16:52 PM
#47
Posts: 2070
yeah it seems silly that a damaged truck could magically morph into a healthy truck. it was a good analogy
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
26 Aug 2014, 16:56 PM
#48
Posts: 2779
So why was katitof's suggestion to make damage carry over to the building dismissed?
I think he made it relatively clear that the okw truck != pioneers.
It sounds like a good compromise (as using the truck in this manner is already at risk to m3s and the like).
Because it is super easy to damage the truck by using M3/WC51, or even Rifles, if the damage carry to the HQ buildings it won't even withstand a few mortar shots, which is totally retarded.
Also, his SC2 drone example is absolutely wrong. Drone with 1 HP will morph into a full HP pool.
26 Aug 2014, 16:58 PM
#49
Posts: 2053
I dismissed the idea because the truck has only 300 health...
Push, get shot at, retreat, heal, then set up.
So teching is delayed by 15 seconds? Repair the thing before setting up.
Push, get shot at, retreat, heal, then set up.
So teching is delayed by 15 seconds? Repair the thing before setting up.
26 Aug 2014, 16:59 PM
#50
Posts: 2070
oh i thought the example was protoss heh. but if damage is carried over, does that deter the use of the truck as an early game "pusher"?
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
26 Aug 2014, 17:02 PM
#51
Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1
I think people are over estimating the risk of truck pushing. You don't truck push with your truck alone. You push with your sturmpios and either a volks squad or a Kubel wagen. If you see an M3 or US jeep, it's not like they can just ignore the sturmpios+kubel and focus down a 300hp armored truck.
26 Aug 2014, 17:03 PM
#52
Posts: 2779
I dismissed the idea because the truck has only 300 health...
Push, get shot at, retreat, heal, then set up.
So teching is delayed by 15 seconds? Repair the thing before setting up.
Sturmpio is a very valuable asset for early game map control and giving pressure, they are not Ostheer pio, you can't use the same logic on them.
The role between Sturm & Volks ~ Pio & Grens is reversed.
26 Aug 2014, 17:04 PM
#53
Posts: 262
Because it is super easy to damage the truck by using M3/WC51, or even Rifles, if the damage carry to the HQ buildings it won't even withstand a few mortar shots, which is totally retarded.
Also, his SC2 drone example is absolutely wrong. Drone with 1 HP will morph into a full HP pool.
Ahh, I see a simple solution. If you're scared of that happening, don't push squads with the truck.
Sounds like the risk you take to me.
As I haven't really encountered the push much, I don't see it as a huge issue. However it seems logical that if you were "totally retarded" with your truck, you deserve a damaged building.
26 Aug 2014, 17:05 PM
#54
Posts: 896
I think people are over estimating the risk of truck pushing. You don't truck push with your truck alone. You push with your sturmpios and either a volks squad or a Kubel wagen. If you see an M3 or US jeep, it's not like they can just ignore the sturmpios+kubel and focus down a 300hp armored truck.
exactly, truck pushing is usually used along with kubel and sturmpios to take away any chance for the allies to fight back in the first engagement.
26 Aug 2014, 17:05 PM
#55
Posts: 915
Its an annoying tactic, but if you focus fire on the truck you could kill it pretty easily.
26 Aug 2014, 17:05 PM
#56
Posts: 2779
Ahh, I see a simple solution. If you're scared of that happening, don't push squads with the truck.
Sounds like the risk you take to me.
As I haven't really encountered the push much, I don't see it as a huge issue. However it seems logical that if you were "totally retarded" with your truck, you deserve a damaged building.
You don't even need to push squad but still having risk they got damaged, unless you stick them in HQ sector.
26 Aug 2014, 17:12 PM
#57
Posts: 262
You don't even need to push squad but still having risk they got damaged, unless you stick them in HQ sector.
Sounds like the de-facto trade off of the faction design. You gain the opportunity to have a Forward position at the cost of increased risk.
If you also want the ability to have a unit that can significantly impact the first engagement(s), more risk should be leveraged.
26 Aug 2014, 17:14 PM
#58
Posts: 332
You have to remember as well time spent microing the truck is time not spent microing units else where.
26 Aug 2014, 17:16 PM
#59
Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1
How about this:
Lower truck armor to 1.
It still has enough HP so it does not get insta-killed the moment it sees infantry, but using it to push close against infantry will mean it will take massive damage.
Lower truck armor to 1.
It still has enough HP so it does not get insta-killed the moment it sees infantry, but using it to push close against infantry will mean it will take massive damage.
26 Aug 2014, 17:17 PM
#60
Posts: 896
You have to remember as well time spent microing the truck is time not spent microing units else where.
When u only have 2-3 units total and all in one area fighting against a similar number of units? I dont know how much time and attention that will take away.
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