Random vs. Random, AT vs. AT
Posts: 336
Problem 1: Randoms matched versus AT players.
(Problem 2: Randoms matched versus random rank of AT players, rather than AT rank.)
Solution: Seperate random players from AT players.
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Population is way too small.
Posts: 336
Besides, a small population should never be an argument to mix random and AT, as players prefer longer waiting times over mismatches, in the long-run.
Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41
Posts: 680
Imo its a pain in the ass. I stopped playing just doing compstomps now and then. Iam hoping for more players after the western front. If that dont happen I think the game is dead.
Posts: 1734
Permanently BannedAnyway it is problem yeah,but that wont happen cuz low population..
Posts: 1679 | Subs: 5
Posts: 627
When I play 2v2 random I get matched versus top 25-50 2v2AT players about half the time (mates aren't always on, so random is a decent alternative). Next to that, it seems that you get matched versus the seperate random ranks of the AT players, thereby ignoring their AT rank, resulting in disproportionate ladder movements.
Problem 1: Randoms matched versus AT players.
(Problem 2: Randoms matched versus random rank of AT players, rather than AT rank.)
Solution: Seperate random players from AT players.
Enjoy waiting 30 minutes for a game.
Posts: 336
There were matched At team against random half year ago, then why it wasnot a problem for you?
Anyway it is problem yeah,but that wont happen cuz low population..
It was a problem back then as well, but AT ladders did not excist yet, so there was no way of knowing if you faced random players or AT players (they could have added eachother on steam after the game, for instance). Personally, I have not played CoH2 random in about 8 months, partially because I stopped playing overall. Therefore, I only just now report this.
As for 2v2, there are more than enough random players and 2v2AT players to seperate the two types. This mismatching problem is part of the reason people stop playing, whereby a downward spiral is created when the argument for not fixing it is a low population.
Not fixing obvious problems leads to a low population, not the other way around.
Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41
There aren't enough players, it would take too long to find games. Relic's algorithm is likely smart enough to make sure the two random players have a higher average rating than the team in order to offset some of the advantage that comes with better communication.
"Take too long to find games" is a really tired argument. While I obviously can't speak for everyone, I for one would rather wait 15 minutes for a good game than stomp a newbie after 3.
Also I wouldn't put much faith in Relic's algorithms when their handling of the new provisional ranking is obviously dumb as a brick (instant...and completely random matchups for 10 games in each game mode for everyone, and with each partner too in AT). For that matter, looking at what kinds of matches higher ranked ATs seem to get, I seriously doubt the matcher is doing anything except try to find players with a combined elo at most x percentage away from the AT, where x keeps growing until a match is made.
Posts: 1679 | Subs: 5
As for the first 10 calibration games, those aren't completely random. You still have a rating, it just has a higher degree of uncertainty, so the range of players you can be matched against is greater and the number of points you can gain from a win is greater since the system doesn't have enough games to make an accurate guess about your skill. It's pretty standard procedure in matchmaking systems these days. So is weighting arranged teams higher than random teams.
As for higher ranked teams getting poor opponents, that's kind of how matchmaking works. It's awful for players at the top because there aren't enough opponents at their rating, so they wait longer and get weaker opponents more often than the average player. This is doubly true for a game like CoH2 with such a small base of players.
Posts: 336
Well, your opinion is not indicative of the opinion of the community at large. Every developer of multiplayer games with matchmaking these days prioritizes timely matchups over better matchup balance. They wouldn't be doing this if they believed a majority of their player base was fine waiting two or three times as long if it meant a better matchup. People don't like waiting 5 or 10 minutes for a game. Look at what Valve has done recently with Dota 2 matchmaking. When they split off into ranked and unranked, they removed a number of options that segmented the player pool in order to keep wait times down around their 2 minute 30 second target. And this is a game with 400,000-600,000 concurrent players every single day. Even they don't want to risk segmenting their community too much.
If timely matchups are prioritized over better matchups, it does not mean there isn't any improvement in this tradeoff. Would a player be willing to wait an additional minute for a closer matchup? Perhaps. Would a player be willing to wait an additional 5 minutes for a perfect matchup? Perhaps not. Would a player abandon the game after relatively long waiting times? Probably not. Would a player abandon the game after multiple stomps? Probably.
Id rather compare CoH2 to CoH1 than to Dota2, for all the obvious reasons. This leads to the observation that reasonable fast and good matchmaking of 2v2s and 2v2ATs is possible with the current player base.
Posts: 1679 | Subs: 5
The CoH2 approach to team matchmaking is infinitely better than that.
Posts: 336
Furthermore, all those random players should not be matched versus AT players, just because a few AT teams cannot bare to wait a few minutes. This is unacceptable. Moreover, the average skill cap between CoH2 players is smaller than between CoH1 players, mainly due to the life span of these games, making even AT matchups easier.
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