COH2 is good. But will you be playing it in 6 months ?

Hello,

My previous post have been seen as rude to many people. It was not my intention. I will never again make a post after seeing abuse in 2 consecutive games (and the abusers where on my side and we won ... but winning is not everything). So i am sorry if some people where offended. I will try to get it right this time.

Over the years i have spent more times playing Relic games than from any other company. I have played them all (on PC) : Homeworld, Dawn of War, Warhammer, Company of Heroes (it’s extensions) and Company of Heroes Online. When this last one was cancelled and closed, it just broke my heart (and thousands of others). The wound is still fresh. Company of Heroes and COHO were called on different well established gaming web site : “The best real time strategy games of all time”. So yes, i’m aware that this is difficult to do a sequel to titles that were (is) so good. So when Company of Heroes 2 was announced, I was thrilled … and having a lot of expectations.

I have played the beta. The game is out there since almost six month. There’s also been some patchs. But is the new iteration any good ?

The simple answer is yes. It is a good game. And a lot better than anything else available at this time. So thank you Relic to bring us good games and for keeping the franchise (COH) going forward.

Now to the more complex answer :

The good :

The Franchise lives !

I like the job Relic have done with the graphical engine for COH2. We have clean and precise graphics, good animations. The sounds are awesome. The artistic direction is in direct continuation of the first games.

True sight is adding to the fun factor and to the possible strategies. Let’s play cat and mouse.

General winter is so so, except for the maps with lakes. Now the map can dynamically change (even more) during the fight. Interesting, useful and it adds variety.

The not so good :

Technical :

Choosing “Peer to peer” server system may look good to corporate exec, but even if the code improved over the last six months, some issues remain. Input lag is frequent (lost orders) and finding opponents takes too long (and I have been mostly playing Russians !. Must be real hard for the germans …. longer waiting time(but it was also true in COHO)). Having dedicated servers is way more efficient. I have a cable 150mb access with low latency. Same thing for my friends. We are not experiencing difficulties, lag or whatsoever with any other games … only with COH2.

My only complaint about the graphics is the low level zoom-out. Come on, a lot of gamers have top notch PC’s and want to use them. You should have the choice to balance your visual settings to accommodate a good zoom out (or set it all to ultra depending on your hardware). Still I can live with the way it is now. But it could be better.

The game :

I must point out that for me the “company” aspect is very important. I am playing almost only 3 VS 3 or 4 VS 4. Most of the times with allied friends, sometimes with total strangers. I have been playing mainly Russians. This is important about my view of the balance problems, because i think that in 1 on 1 (or 2 VS 2), they are less of an issue.

The way resource points have been change feels like a mistake to me. In COH, munitions points gave munitions, fuel point gave fuel, and pop point gave just that. You could improved their outputs (and protect them with OP), but it remained the same type of resources. This gave territory much more importance and intense fights that were really meaning something. Now with points giving a bit of everything, it’s a set back. The former system was better as it required more planning and cunning strategy, as well as really bloody battles (your mission is to take munitions hill and to keep it at all cost!).

The commanders. Too many of them are overlapping (pinned post at the top of this forum with interesting suggestions) or are just plain useless. But what is most important, they are not dynamic. In COH you could choose between 3 types of doctrine, and develop them in the sequence you needed DURING the game. Much more interesting and pertinent. In COHO, there was this kind of RPG elements : with the commanders, you were able to build your OWN tech tree (within certain limits), and there was the heroes units. That was giving real reasons to grind some of them, even when you lost a battle you were marching toward a goal. Sure, sometimes it was frustrating, but in the long run, it was just pure fun. And very addictive (with the loot system, what kind of rewards would you get after a big match). So far I have played around 300 hours of CHO2. It is a lot less (really) than to COH or COHO, but the game is still young. And with 300 hours for 50 bucks, I can say that I’ve had a lot for my money. I even bought the commanders in DLC. To support RELIC. But to some it looks like pay to win (I am not sure about that, no opinion yet). I would be a lot more enthusiasm to buy “Commander slots” to start building new (build your own tech tree " à la COHO") commanders (like you buy mech bays in Wechwarriors Online”).It gives you more control, leave some place to creativity and gives you reasons to change your style of play and to start gaining XP again ! It also brings cash to the DEV.

In COH2 you have a smaller population cap, and individual units don’t seem so important. This is some kind of a paradox. When a faction (side, 4 playes) can spam the same units (Panther, Tiger Ace, T70 and T34) and roll over the enemy almost untouch there is a problem. The strategy went a little out of the window in 4 VS 4. In COH (and COHO), unsupported tanks were really vulnerable. If you took a pack of them, charged … it was almost certain death ! Now you can do it. Don’t need a lot of skill. Just rush, spam and win. Like so many RTS games. Watching an isolated Ostwind circle around two ZIS and take them down is sad ... and it is wrong.

Another great thing in COH was the terrain, the cover and the houses. The cover system in COH universe, the buildings and the destructible war zone is part of the “unique” aspects of the game compared to other RTS.I know that in the latest patch the DEV have adjust the critical hits to building in COH2, but still, they are too few of them, and they are too easily destructible. So here is another loss in strategic elements of the game.

The community :

It is great that you are able now to launch 4 VS 4, and to be able to do it even when you are alone (was not possible in VCOH). The latest channel chat addition is ok, but this is also a major set back from the ingame Lobby and community chat we had in COHO. And, I don’t know if it’s because of the peer to peer (instead of dedicated servers) or if it’s by having only a small group of players at any given time (RELIC did sell at least 400 000 COH2 (the last time it was mentioned)), but these channels are almost empty. And finding a game takes a long time.

Those are my main issues for now. My friends and I recently download “Eastern Fronts” for VCOH. This is another good thing with Relic, it welcome modders ! And the people behind Eastern Front did a really good (fantastic !) job. For now, I think I will let COH2 aside to play Eastern Fronts with friends (old game, not a large community anymore). Maybe in a few months COH2 will get better and gain a new momentum. When you buy a new version of software or a new computer, you want to do more things with it, to have new features that matters, with COH2 you get a good game, but one that is somehow a diluted version of the previous ones.

I think if those issues (and some others) are addressed, Relic could sell more DLC, start thinking about an expansion pack and so on. I really wish it.

Anyway, thanks to RELIC for the games you have released so far,

Swiss Cheese

I'm a WW2 buff so I'll probably stick around.

But the frequency I play with might be affected by how much Relic continues to spam crazy commanders.

As long as my friends dont drop out for any reason (doesnt look like it). I will be in.

After a few games with my friends with the mod Eastern Front for VCOH, it has blown in our face that this is a far better game than COH2 as it is for now. It's just amazing the diversity of possibilities, of strategies of complementarity. Probably has some problem with balance, but COH as always been asymetric warfare and since there are so much possible strategies (no follow this strat, do the same thing over and over, to win). And the pathfinding is SO MUCH better ! That's the game we will be playing for now, hoping that COH2 will get better.

I love the game, so I'll prob be sticking around unless they drastically change anything.

My answer to your question in title: yes.

I will only quit the game when I see a commander that gives you 2 elite T-70 at 0 CP`s

I don't think I'll play much more.

I was a 2vs2 player in vCoH and at first in CoH2 I played that mode too, but now I only enjoy 3vs3 or even 4vs4 games because I've the feel that the game is broken anyway, so with more players I don't feel as bad when I lose against a Tiger Ace or Soviet Industry T70 spam.

I can blame the high number of players instead of the crappy balance of the game.

COH2 is good. But will you be paying for it in 6 months ?

fix'd

I didn't know coh 2 was good.

If they keep on at this pace, no.

i liked coh2 at the start, but after u stop caring about fancy graphics and see the actual gameplay you get bored really quickly, plus relic keeps breaking game again and again, cant be bothered playing a broken game, i stopped playing already and most likelly wont come back to it

Vcoh is definitely a joke for me, Baton can get lv16 by spam one unit: sniper, in Vcoh, sniper play a quite role in a game, coz mortar and MG only has 3 members and infantry units can not vault,it is so frustrating, once you have a wagen to help sniper increase the sight, i dont see a way to actually stop them, without true sight like in COH2, flank is not an option. Coh2 definitely got something Vcoh should learn about,support weapon like MG or mortar is more important in COH2,every fraction can build their indirect fire vehicle.i dont have a problem against soviet industry or tiger ace doc and i play both side, frankly speaking, i havent purchased single new commander yet and getting tired of those 3 commanders in VCOH. If you like VCOH, just go play VCOH, if you want play COH2, just have fun in COH2, people say new op commander ruins the game, well, new commander makes game much more option, people whine it coz they cant handle the loss or win a game so hard, for me, i am just playing a game.

Vcoh is definitely a joke for me, Baton can get lv16 by spam one unit: sniper, in Vcoh, sniper play a quite role in a game, coz mortar and MG only has 3 members and infantry units can not vault,it is so frustrating, once you have a wagen to help sniper increase the sight, i dont see a way to actually stop them, without true sight like in COH2, flank is not an option. Coh2 definitely got something Vcoh should learn about,support weapon like MG or mortar is more important in COH2,every fraction can build their indirect fire vehicle.i dont have a problem against soviet industry or tiger ace doc and i play both side, frankly speaking, i havent purchased single new commander yet and getting tired of those 3 commanders in VCOH. If you like VCOH, just go play VCOH, if you want play COH2, just have fun in COH2, people say new op commander ruins the game, well, new commander makes game much more option, people whine it coz they cant handle the loss or win a game so hard, for me, i am just playing a game.

Not sure if serious or troll

Just so you know, this was Barton's way of trolling the game with his SSSSS Strat.

Well, it's true that sniper play in vCoH was seriously retarded.

And combinations like cloacked ketten+sniper ruined the game completely.

Even so, vCoH early game was a lot better. Much more better.
The only COH2 infantry unit that I really enjoy playing with are penals.
Is the only early infantry that gives the feeling that they are actually shooting bullets.

How I'd wish they'd got ATnades at vt3 :3

I gave up on COH on release. I played through alpha and beta, on release I played for about a week before facepalming and uninstalling.


I recently just started playing it again for lack of anything better to do I guess. MVGame

I will decide with the next dlc release, so I should probably make way for something else seeing I haven't played since last patch. I don't like the fact that core units get balanced against stupid dlc commanders

Ill be here before DoW3 or CoH3 come out

I probably will be, if the game isnt destroyed by DLC before then, which is unfortunately to my mind a very real risk unless someone sensible at Relic really thinks about where they want to be in 6 months relating to that.

As for me, I'd probably want to hang around this community, which seems pretty mature, but probably won't play COH2 in 6 months at the rate things are going.