First Quarter 2021 Balance Patch

I hope to reconsider the infantry squad size upgrades.

The COH2's infantry support weapon upgrades are designed to deliver a performance boost of around 20% - such as BAR, LMG42, et al. .

However, according to Lancaster's Law, if a 4 men squad is upgraded to a 5 men squad, the performance will increase by 5^2/4^2=1.5625= 56%.
Similarly, if the performance is improved by 7 men for 6 men, the performance means 7^2/6^2=1.3611=36% performance improvement.
This is clearly considered OP.

The recent patches for countless infantry have completely shaken the game's roots, and I think it's really problematic.
Look at the conventions. Only the same commander is selected each time, and only very stereotyped strategies emerge. It's not so much fun.

I agree with Orangepest, Volks being trash is the main issue. OST is supposed to crutch on MG42 with pio support. But you cant cap a map this way in 1v1. So you spam grens which are weak and you lose. Your only option is Ass grens or Ostruppen. Especially since flame track got nerfed.

I am not the balance guy. But I used to play this game a shit ton. And one thing I saw everyday is network/server lag. If you have long range units with lag, weird shit happens. Your long range units will be very weak because they wont start to attack until the enemy is almost on top of you.

Example:
1) I make brit IS in green cover, Sturms rush me and rekt my no-no hole.
2) I make sturms and rush IS in cover, I drop 2 models before I get there.

So either pios need a buff to protect MGs better or Grens need a slight buff on close range so they are not merely relegated to being rape witnesses.

Buffing grens will water down the game since they will become more like every other faction. But who really wants the other option, MG spam?

And of course the real-real issue is units doing way too much DPS close range. With lag and shitty animation code you should not be able to lose a whole squad in less then 5 seconds. But that would be a huge change. Too late for that. But for COH3 lets hope they hear us.

4man grens need something so they don´t get insta wiped by arty

4man grens need something so they don´t get insta wiped by arty

But... that's the point of arty. You don't carpet bomb an area and somehow survive. They will never get insta wiped by arty on the first shot unless they are all clumped up.

4man grens need something so they don´t get insta wiped by arty

True. If only they had a 20% received damage reduction at vet 3...

Judging by Sander93’s thread, it seems highly likely that my old proposal to lower Ostheer medkit costs from 15 to 10 will make it to the preview. Other than that, I’m not sure what kind of buff LMG Grenadiers could be given. I did have an idea to give them a unique “hit the dirt” ability that immobilizes them (can cancel it after 10secs or retreat immediately) which would give them 5-10 extra LMG42 range. This both fits their role and plays to their strengths and defensive nature without being overbearing.

Not sure what else could be done. What kind of changes do you have in mind?

Probably along the side of increasing the midrange dps or close range dps with rifles, Just something so they can actually fight without upgrade, even with lmg its still not that strong tbh. Like the moment they get in green cover you actually cant push them, the opposite cannot be said for rifles/sections.

The issue with LMG grens isn't that they're bad per se, it's that they utterly incapable of attacking into green cover in any effective way (Speaking form a 2v2 perspective here). That issue is only compounded by the shit map pool, which generally means you have little or no room at all to flank.

G43 Grens are hopeless, and I'm not sure what can be done to fix them without making them too good.

Putting the Stuka anywhere other than Mechanized HQ is a giant buff to the unit and the faction.

sadly that's true

What will happen when normal grens go up against vetted rifles with two bars. They'll get their shitstomped.

To be honest double bar rifles isn't something frequent from what I've observed

sadly that's true


To be honest double bar rifles isn't something frequent from what I've observed

People fail to mention that double bar rifles is 120 munitions upgrade on top of a 280 MP squad that has a snare locked behind a vet. So not only is it expensive, especially for USF which needs muni for penetration and smoke, but also rare outside of 4v4s. Why do people think that grens should assault positions? They have a rifle nade that synergizes so well with PGrens push, especially since it's a "long" animation so you can micro PGrens once you fire the rifle nade into green cover. Or you know.... werfer the area before advancing. Why can't people understand that you can't use grens the same way you use rifles. They are cheaper and have an earlier LMG upgrade that comes naturally without side tech. Great for holding area, especially with vet3 dmg reduction. 5gren are not OP and 4gren are not UP. Stop crying for crying out loud.

If normal Grenadiers get buffed what is the reason OKW even exists? Volks are not even better than Grens in combat strength as it is. The only advantage they have is sandbags and not being locked behind a tier.

http://www.companyofheroes.com/blog/2020/11/25/winter-balance-patch-202021-wc-2020-recap-and-64-bit-update

It say there are not going to change how fundamental or certain components play.
Then again there are going to be quality of life changes.

I really hope OKW trucks get some of Sanders proposed changes. I wonder under which category that belongs.


Also, seeing who will be part of the patch-team, i am really looking forward to the pre-patches and am likely to contribute feedback. It´s surely going to be interesting

I'd ask for something to be done about the OKW vs UKF matchup but clearly it must be on the radar by now That and the usual complaints from my end are pretty well known by this stage I think.

EDIT: Oh and someone should probably take a look at that faust bug if it's still hanging around. Not sure if still relevant but the combination of smoke (like an AEC's) and faust seem to miss though I cannot confirm by myself....

I havent give up hope that the useless "Thorough Salvage" will finally be replaced with a useful ability.
Besides that I hope that some off meta commanders get some love, there are plenty of good ideas in the threads.

Putting the Stuka anywhere other than Mechanized HQ is a giant buff to the unit and the faction.

The only way to nerf stuka would be to lock it behind all 3 Tiers like the KT

Here are my ideas for some minor OKW commander improvements:

Scavenge doctrine:
"Thorough Salvage" out, replaced by "Captured weapons":
Works like the standard weapon drop, would provide us mortar / 1 Bar (up for discussion)
The new ability would fit well to the theme and be a lot more useful than "Thorough Salvage"

Fortress doctrine:
- Pak43 and LeFh merged to "Heavy support weapons": Jibber already suggested this in his wehr commander proposals
- new ability: Ambush Camouflage

I've suggested this in the past in regards for Kar98 Grens.

Firing upon suppressed units inquires a 0.50/0.75 acc penalty. The 2nd one IIRC is only for SMGs. Give Grens Kar98 the same 0.75 acc penalty.

Here are my ideas for some minor OKW commander improvements:

Scavenge doctrine:
"Thorough Salvage" out, replaced by "Captured weapons":
Works like the standard weapon drop, would provide us mortar / 1 Bar (up for discussion)
The new ability would fit well to the theme and be a lot more useful than "Thorough Salvage"

Fortress doctrine:
- Pak43 and LeFh merged to "Heavy support weapons": Jibber already suggested this in his wehr commander proposals
- new ability: Ambush Camouflage

The focus of this patch is: Core Armies!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

so no overall commander changes

If Ost grens are getting buffed, then I think their support weapons shouldn't be as strong as they are since the entire justification of Ost support weapons being high performance as they are will be the claims of Ost core infantry lacking in performance. Fighting an Ost Maginot line is tough as UKF if you don't lock in royal arty or lend lease, and lend lease is another doctrine that I think that could use some work since the best thing about it are the assault tommies and everything else is just... "okay" bordering mediocre. The 81mm mortar seems outclassed in my opinion.

I havent give up hope that the useless "Thorough Salvage" will finally be replaced with a useful ability.

The time penalty of thorough salvage got removed a few months ago, so now its just a straight up better version of the normal salvage. Same time and +12 muni for wrecks/weapon teams and +36mun for abandoned vehicles.

How is that useless?