Profile of raw

I had conscripts stuck in open terrain like this once. I.e. no wall or any other object in touching distance. They unstuck when they got shot.

1. VCOH's MP system tended to be harsher. At most, you were only going to get +12MP from the map. Still significant but didn't really offset it. Also, your base MP rate was never +300 in VCOH unless if you had supply yard lvl 2 and you had good map control

Comparing absolut values is bogus, as units cost completely different amounts of MP between the games. And even if they wouldn't you could still not compare it, as the timings would be different, what you have is different, what you face is different...

Drawing these number comparisions is useless at best. However, the existance of the MP differential is exactly what paid a good amount of infantry maintainance.

2. Tanks costing less MP would mean more MP for fuel caches, thereby offsetting the fuel increase anyway.

You forget that a more active infantry around the map can also dispatch caches more quickly and more reliably, like it was in CoH1 for example.

If you want tanks costing less MP so that infantry gain a strong presence, that's a bit too newb friendly I'll have to admit.

The goal here is not that losing your infantry pieces should be inconsequential. By all means, someone who keeps losing men left and right should definitely feel that in his pocket. The problem is that having build infantry /at all/ gets more and more inconsequential the longer the game progresses due to
- exorbitant maintainance costs
- armor vastly outperforming infantry
- inability of infantry to deal with anything on the field but infantry (exception: pgrens)
- instagibs

That results in the simple fact, that when I invest into infantry, keep them alive, am active with them around the map, actively kick out enemy troops of their entrenchments and ultimately kill, I am still the dumb idiot, because the other guy just sat there and waited for his tank, instantly negating /anything/ the infantry ever did on the field.

3. There was one patch where T-34s used to cost 240 MP and idk how much fuel. That is the cost of a conscript squad. The result was simply spamming T-34s, esp if you had a fuel cache.

Spamming vehicles works because they are too potent, not because they don't cost enough. Infantry needs to be able to project a stronger presence on the field even when armor is out. That is the core issue, and not some fancy number games on MP and fuel costs. Axing MP costs on tanks would atleast allow you to pay the horrendous infantry maintainance costs going mid late, and would allow you to viably transition from an infantry heavy early.

reduced MP would only result in more tank spam.

That's exactly why I also suggested to raise fuel alongside, so the decision process mid/lade isn't "let me think a secon..TANK". Tanks should be strong, but they should also be precious.

Pretty sure you did there

I'm not even sure lowering MP costs on tanks is a good thing. This will definitely open up to more fuel caches/OP trucks

And for 300 MP, vehicles are already very cheap. In VCOH, with a MP system which was even harsher, your main tanks costs 400 MP.

VCOH's MP system wasn't harsher and it isn't even comparable, as the MP income was dependant on territory held and not a constant rate. That ment that you had more MP income going toward mid, and the difference between base and mid is exactly what allowed you to field tanks while still paying the maintainance costs of your infantry. In CoH2 you simply can't do that. Hence the game degenerates over time. To reflect the all new constant resources system of CoH2, Tanks must cost significantly less MP, simple as that, which would allow you to maintain both your infantry aswell as buy new tanks and with that effectively ending the spamfest and giving infantry a strong presence on the field, instead of being useless cannonfodder as it is now. Upping fuel costs would push tank timings further out, increasing their rarity (which is a good thing in the context of CoH) and putting more weight on both the non-armor defense/offense play, and capturing and holding points for extended periods of time, so this would be a nice addition, but that isn't actually the main point.

Edit: The other half of the issue is that MP decrease/pop was significantly better mapped to the actual costs of the units you could purchase.

Tbh, the fuel costs for tanks are already quite high.

Great. Except that is not was this thread is about.

Actually you can only fight tanks with tanks.

That wasn't something I put into my OP but yes, that is a completely logical consequence when armor is blow for blow more efficient at everything that infantry does and also costs just as much.