I'm not the one who tried to claim that PaK guns are bouncing off E8s at all ranges. FFS, you've probably got a better chance of missing your target outright than bouncing the shot.
You can argue about the cost/effectiveness of the unit all you want, but trying to pass that turd just isn't going to happen. Sorry your pal got called out on a stupid statement, but there it is.
I don't get your point... Paks can bounce off the Easy Eight at all ranges, so his claim is correct. What's the deal here? |
All of this talk about Shocktroops supports my closing thoughts concerning Soviet faction design.
- 6 commanders have Shocktroops.
- Out of those 6 commanders 3 have viable late game armor (if you count KV1).
- Your likelihood of encountering these 2 commands is greater than encountering a commander like Urban Defense.
- This is predictable game play.
I'd support this as well, in the interest of not only the Soviets but the German factions- just about everyone loads up Guards Motor and Shock Rifle, with the last slot filled by ISU/Lend Lease/Counterattack/some doctrine with ppsh and elite inf. What I'd give to fight a FHQ, or Urban Defense, or even Partisans without having the Soviet player be gimped at the same time. |
Sometimes COH2 is frustrating, and sometimes it's just really fun. This game was really fun.
Many Obers vs many Shocks, a captured Zis eventually becoming indispensable, and the (eventually vet 3) Command Panther + Jagdpanzer doing sterling service against 3 IS2s. Not to mention a LeIG which did very nicely against the Maxims.
Also featuring liberal use of Mark Target by the Panther (which doesn't seem to do nearly as much as the normal Soviet mark, maybe IS2s are just that beefy). The Panther is worth it over the standard nondoctrinal version even after T4 is built just for the superb sight range it gets, not to mention the aura. |
>Buys Tank Destroyer
>Loses to tank of similar cost
It's balanced guys!
If only every map in this game wasn't filled with sight blockers and choke points and pathing actually worked!
People here can theorycraft all they want but to anyone who actually plays this game(i.e. not the musical chairs that is 1v1 that about 5% of the population plays(Optimistically speaking)) they know that the Jackson's a subpar unit in general. But frankly, this even applies in 1v1.
If you played more and theorycrafted less you'd know that the Jackson and P4 will trade off and blow each other up in a dead tie even if the P4 teleported right into 40 range. So if you're losing Jacksons to P4s you're just screwing up and letting him shoot first, even though you have hold fire and he doesn't.
Starting at 60 range and with the P4 blitzing forward and the Jackson reversing, the P4 will get one shot off before being reduced to bits of scrap metal at 11 seconds into the engagement. |
You can't "flank" something when your troops don't have the power to at least hold their ground. They get totally assraped by grens especially with lmg 42. And again, why do I need at least 2 x 240 MP units to counter a single 240 MP unit?
Conscripts are more than adequate until LMGs en masse start appearing, and they can most definitely stand their ground by using and abusing the German faction's difficulty in degarrisoning early on, oorah to reposition or rush houses, throwing molotovs with multiple squads in different engagements to reduce dodge chance, truesight round corners to trump Grenadiers, and sandbags to hold ground. They definitely don't need twice the numbers to stand up.
Later on when LMGs roll out, you can't tackle static grenadiers nearly so easily, but in the games I play tanks/demos/suppression/indirect fire take over the role of fighting the infantry blob. That's just the way the Soviets are designed- conscripts scale worse without PPsHs and it's not going to change, so work around this weakness. |
SSWhiney at his best. You have to micro the shit out of you're fingers while the OKW or Ostheer player plays with one hand masturbating and if your lucky you come equal to him. You just need to stand still with Grens and they rape everything. Melee advantage? My ass. You come close, they rape you. Why do I need 2 x 240 MP troops to beat 1x 240 MP Grens? Bullshit.
If you're going to be completely wrong, at least be polite at the same time...
Honestly, I find Soviets/US a heck of a lot easier than Wehr (reserving judgment on OKW). Flank, stall around in buildings and as US bring out the halftrack, and you're gold- it just feels like a lot less thinking is involved.
And the Jackson will almost kill a Tiger with 4 penetrating shots, KovuTalli, not 5. |
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Jacksons dominate all non doctrinal Wehr armor for cost and are unflankable in the manner of the Su85. I'd be hesitant buffing it too much beyond target priority switches. |
Blizzards reward active, aggressive, good play and punish bad players.
Nothing more, nothing less.
You don't have to love them, but if you can't use them, you're bad.
There's much more to it than that. Blizzards benefit armies with short ranged oriented weapons, allow tanks to bumrush AT guns from the front in situations where this would be impossible without the blizzard, makes avoiding vehicle snares harder, makes MGs far less useful, makes camping buildings for vision even more potent, thus benefitting armies with good anti garrison power, among many other things.
So blizzards do affect unit balance and usefulness, and hence affect faction balance overall. |
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Not to mention, DPS in buildings with fewer windows than squadmembers would vary considerably depending on which man was at the window.
Anyway because the accumulated strength of the squad would be the same, there would be little point. Maybe if the squad leader got a different model, just as a cosmetic touch?
On an unrelated note I'd really like it if the Wehr Grenadiers got the same uniform that volks have now... the green jumpsuits they currently wear are just hideous. |
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E8s fire slower but with more penetration than the M4C. Other than that they're comparable (tiger ignores both their armor values anyway).
M4C is probably more effective because the 76mm autocannon it has has such a nasty rate of fire. The Rifle company has a really good offmap that can nullify anything behind though, so make of it what you will. |
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