Can it just...actually do damage?
This thing is supposed to replace Rocket Arty in the USF roster.
What scott lacks in alpha strike damage the werfer and stuka have, it more than makes up for in continuous bleed. What remains to be seen, once more people start playing it, whether the patch will kill it or do something about it. While I do not know who complained about scott being UP or OP, for such big reworks to hit it. Time will tell. |
Yeah the smoke barrage serves a different role than WP though. I'm talking about removing the vet 1 personal smoke, not the smoke barrage. My point is that it doesn't need the personal smoke because it has the barrage
Oh, sorry about that. Yeah, if one removes the self smoke canister, that would be a big hit to it's survivability that would have to be offset by WP or something like that. |
White phosphorus barrage would do the trick on that too. Lock it behind vet 1, shared cooldown. Get rid of smoke dispenser, unnecessary anyway with the smoke barrage
Smoke barrage is in my opinion superior to WP. At least in it's current form on Scott. Large AOE, no muni cost, Ability to carpet it. Indispensable in team games. Don't know how many times I've won an engagement thanks to Scotts smoke barrage covering tanks from Elefants and other menaces. |
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I like the regular smoke as it is. Lots of smoke, good AOE. WP would do nothing since it's mostly a small AOE and takes time to do damage and would probably cost munitions. |
I am not sure what your point is.
My point was that simply adding any tech cost to a squad is naive at the very best. I could arbitrarily split 20 fuel of the cost of BP1 to the riflenade or 20 from any of the OKW tech to Panzerfaust unlock, because that is my perceived value of it. I mean, I get it as a benefit together with access to other units. If I rush any unit, let's say a medium tank, do I add up all the tech and build costs and then use it for performance comparison vs other tanks? Why does my T34/76 not wreck that frickin' Tiger (at least before heavies were bound to tech)?
That's how I assume people must think that add tech cost to units. At least it would explain some of the forum posts and suddenly other weird stuff looks surprisingly "normal".
The alternative obviously that we just don't. Because it does not make any sense.
Agreed. If you build 4 conscripts, let's say a 200mp 20 fuel unlock means that each conscript "costs" 50 MP more and 5 fuel more. That would be a mathematical function translating from one group (tech cost) to another (conscript cost). The more conscripts you buy, the "cheaper" the unlock is. Of course, some factions do not have such stuff, but other factions also do not have the versatility in infantry as USF and UKF do.
All in all, agreed. One should not look at unlocks as something that inflates the price of conscripts, or any infantry for that matter. And placing nade and molly in one tech seems to be the right choice, considering that soviets do not have any sort of infantry versatility. |
I know you like to repeat this point over and over again, so I'll do it as well:
Allied factions are designed for having to buy side techs and thereby delay their main tech. This is fully intended for viable builds. Just adding the cost to the infantry unit itself is exactly doing the same thing you are mocking others for: Looking at things in a total vacuum. Like comparing pure Gren builds to pure Con builds. It's completely blind to faction design and therefore by far not as clear cut "true" as you present it.
Aren't USF and UKF the "only" (2/3) allied factions that have it? While I do not think that any of the mainline/elite infantry is in any way OP or UP (from conscripts to obers or 5men grens), the molly/AT nade in conscripts seems out of place, especially since you absolutely positively need the engineers with flamethrowers early on to counter possible strong buildings placements. Right now, the current version of the patch, where both upgrades are in one seems like a good option. Can be a bit infuriating that you need to bring your combat engies to the frontlines just to displace MG42s, whereas grens can do that from a safe distance with the natural rifle nade (or considering the fact that maxim is in a tier building, and poor at suppression, don't even need to)
Grens are completely fine. They fit nicely overall in OST. Would be nice to see them have extra damage vs suppressed units or some sort of "defensively-offensive" buff if you catch my drift. To further the notion of a defensive mainline unit. Especially with the defensive vet buff it gets to be viable in late game teamgames. |
The Brummbar is far from a perfect unit... if you want a perfect unit I suggest you look at the SU152 and the Comet. You know units with NO weaknesses.
Now back to the Brummbar , the Ostwind is a far better choice 90% of the time and it's cheaper. The Brummbar is far to micro intensive to able to utilize the gun properly along with it's pitiful range and slow rate of fire. It's auto fire is an absolute mess.
You can scream bad artisan as much as you like but facts are facts and let's not also forget your laughable play time in CoH 2 
What of the Stug E ? How does everyone find this unit ? I vote it as the worst unit in the game right now.
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Ost MG42 is part of a larger problem imho where the MG42 is too good, but has to be because grens are a weak unit. So ppl will try to spam them out in that 2xpio, 2xmg42 build. 3 x mg42 + mortars is very obnoxious to play against, esp if they have an OKW teammate who'll just outman your ass.
I'm not complaining about MG42. In my view, it's fine. I wouldn't call grens a weak unit. Not a survivable one, that's for sure. They scale quite well and their one weak point is the close range firepower. Upgraded or not, they have high damage (16) rifles with high accuracy for long range, which fits well into the faction. Grens will always win long range, and their long range nade doubles down on it. Compared to conscripts, who's whole thing is to be behind cover and have large numbers, I'd say it's balanced, considering that's the soviet shtuck.
One thing that is good about conscripts late game is the 7th man upgrade. Comparing to grens, which are 4 man unless a doctrine is chosen, people deem it OP. But one has to understand that at the point where the 7th man comes online, katys, werfers, stukas and other obnoxious things are fielded. Now a katy will never wipe grens in a single salvo unless super unlucky, whereas a werfer likes larger squads, or stuka. So in the end, you can't use grens like you would use cons or rifles and in the end, it all works out. |
I think we may be thinking about different game modes in which case nvm.
Speaking from 3v3+, there are many lane-y maps such as Redball, Across the Rhine (not Ettelbruck surprisingly), Arnhem where flanks are simply impractical/easy to stop. With three Maxims, you can have one covering the flank and 2 for the front, resulting in a practically uncrackable defence before ISGs arrive. Ostheer ally mortars can be matched with teammate mortars and heaven help you if they have a Sniper in all of this.
This doesn't take into account the teammate getting an MG either.
While I agree, same thing could be said about other MGs. T0 MG42 can lock out good parts of Across the rheine (one, not 3 like maxims). I don't remember if I've ever played Rheine against anything else but 2x pio 2x MG42. Really strong positions that map has. 3v3, anything is viable TBH. Never seen a tactic, from Rear echelon spam, over Combat engies spam, over sturmpio spam all the way to maxim spam that didn't work out at least once, especially if it captures you by surprise. 1v1 maxim is useless to spam.
All in all, I'd rather see penals get the rework needed to be AI that can upgrade into 3x PTSR for some late game AT power. Maxim is fine, considering which faction it is in. Maybe a bit lower setup time. Nothing too much, |
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I don't really use Raketen, but wouldn't it be a bit broken in teamgames, especially late game? Considering it's an ATG that can retreat, so you don't risk a lot bringing it on the frontline.
Not sure though so not gonna comment further. |
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