Profile of Protos Angelus

To be fair here in 3v3\4v4 allies players are usually complete apes. While there are terminal stages of stupidity on axis side aswell, for allies its much more dangerous to be a retard.

My formula is:
Total noob axis vs total noob allies - Determened by who is more retarded
Noob axis vs noob allies - in Axis favor
Mediocre axis vs mediocre Allies - more or less fair, slightly in axis favor
Good Axis vs good Allies - more or less fair, slightly in Allies favor
Pro Axis vs Pro Allies - in Allies favor

Right now, at least from my experience of 3v3\4v4 you dont have any challenges as Axis untill you hit like rank 14 in 3v3\4v4. But it still mostly determened by who you got as a teammate, so at rank 16-17 you will start facing good allies who can play the game.

High rank axis player will always beat high rank allies player. Soviet the hardest, USF the easiest; in teamgames. Played against rank 3 and 4 players 3 times in a row, same thing, to great effect, every time:
OKW vs USF = kubel + spios rush, great kubel control, rifles bleed and retreat.
USF vs OST = MG42 + pios spotting + 3x gren blob. On most maps that's impossible to flank, and you really need to decide whether you let RE + 2x rifles take the main heat of the blobs or you flank with RE + rifles. But that takes a great bit of time on most 3v3+ maps, not to mention that grens win long range so all you have to do is sit alongside the MG42 line.
Literally if you have skill, you should have no problems dealing with any USF player, and somewhat brit player. Soviets are another story. Seen a lot of high rank soviets playing 2x Maxim to great effect, with great control over them, shuts down OKW on lane-y maps hard, and OST to some degree.

On some maps, Pak43 is downright OP (angermunde, hill400...) if you don't have the doctrinal tools to take it down. On angremunde, buildings block almost all non vertical indirects, even when destroyed and on Hill400 it can shoot through multiple layers of ground/obstacles/tree-lines. On other, wider and more open maps, it's completely useless. Mostly it's a problem of lacking stock units that can take it out. For the 17pdr, OKW has the flame stuka which will kill it even when braced I think (tightrope showed it if I'm not mistaken), and OST has the werfer which will either kill it or severely damage it if the brace is activated before the volley (let's be honest, nobody is going to activate brace for werfer, you'll be busy moving your units).

One also has to take into consideration the following:
17pdr is a building, and as such has a large area that when damaged, will destroy the building and the gun. Pak43 is a big ass gun that can be decrewed. So shooting at a pak43 with... let's say pak howi barrage, you may or may not decrew it, depending on the scatter luck. Shooting at a 17pdr with a ISG: Every barraging shell will damage it and once it's gone, the whole gun is gone.

I think this is one aspect to take into consideration. For pak43 you need pinpoint accuracy, but no brace and can be decrewed, for 17pdr you don't need any of that, but brace is there to help out (which means engies will be on repair duty).

I'd make both 17pdr and pak43 pretty much identical in survivabiltiy/firepower and remove the wallhack completely.
For uniqueness, you can add abilities or w/e to those guns. Pak43 could have piercing shot, 17pdr could have HE shot or whatever.

I work now 4-5? years in the BT and i can tell you we never saw 1 single penny.
Same for my mappatches.

Well then I take back everything I've said. Bloody shame that is. You do work and brainstorm and for what? Cunt dollars? Shameful Lelic

What's your solution then?
Lowering P4Js armor? The unit is fairly balanced for cost and timing itself (at least in my opinion), so the only way that should work is with a simultaneous cost decrease. Which would basically make it an Ostheer P4.
Increasing the 51mm penetration? Screws over other targets as well.
Increase the ability's pen gain? Basically same as above.

Look, I've been arguing for redesigning USF's AT options including the ATG for long now because in my opinion the current system only forces USF into a Jackson.
The biggest difference to the situation P4 vs Jackson is also the scope of the changes: Making the Jacksons thin armor a little bit thinner is in line with the unit and almost exclusively affects the P4 and the Puma. The armor nerf was done to ensure that good positional play is important and finding someone out of position is rewarded.
Should you have been rewarded in your video? Yes, surely. But changing any of these two units to guarantee the penetration changes way more than just those two units.

While I don't think anything should be done as this is the prime case of bad RNG (eg. I've had games where my RE/Major 4 zooks penetrated 6 times in a row on a Panther frontally, eg. Good RNG).
OKW P4 is the prime medium tank in the game, even for that timing as it can take on every other stock medium without a hitch, while a Panther can secure dives. Something that OKW is reliant on, a P4 + Panther dive will always win vs a TD + medium tank on almost all 2v2 and 3v3 maps.
I don't think anything needs changing. If anything, maybe, a big maybe the OKW P4 gets 200 armour and a price decrease. Who knows. They do have the stock KT, so even making an AT gun vs OKW as USF is not really a good investment. I myself always preferred sending a zook blob along the margins of the map with a sweeper, bait the KT on the frontlines and then just let it rip on it's ass.

Because that's a case of a medium tank making it into the "vulnerable" range of a TD. The TD shouldn't be in a position to be hit by the P4. It's not quite a comparable situation.

One could also say "P4 should not be able to repair on the frontline and bounce AP shots in a row. The P4 shouldn't be in a position to be hit by the AT gun".

This is pure bad RNG, but still, that's not an argument that holds water, that these are different scenarios.