i dont get why some people just cant get over the fact that you have to get close. especially seeing how most maps have clusters of shot blockers that allow you to do that freely as long as you are aware of one or two flanks.
once ostheer t4 becomes more viable, i really think 10 sec reduce in barrage rate would be enough.
The issue is even if you are behind a shotblocker you can't escape from him in time (and not every map has shot blockers...) because the Pwerf has extremely poor pathing and acceleration. |
I hate giving this bug up as I enjoy using it, however I must set an example for my other Bears.
The Panzer Commander in the OKW Elite Armored doctrine is bugged.
- Select the Panzer Commander upgrade
- Then select the MG42 upgrade
- You now have two people sharing one port hole
- Note the order of the build, it won't work the other way around.
Elite Armored is probably the most bugged commander in the game, what with HEAT shells refusing to activate, sometimes not applying the damage buff, and the emergency repair permanently making your tank get insta abandoned. |
They seem to die pretty often to single nade.
Lets not mention stuka.
Conscripts also should operate at the same range as grens, they are same 240mp after all, right?
And pwerfer have more armor then katy as well as much better mobility(inb4 you mention survivability difference of grens and cons).
Not to mention that katy is BAD from max range, you use it only if you don't have another choice, otherwise its always better to get as close as possible, thats not really any different to pwerfer.
The Pwerfer and Katy have exactly the same mobility profile. The Katy functions best at medium range like it should, it can do more than enough damage without having to sit insanely close to the enemy lines.
The pwerfer doesn't have much more armor either, it has only 20 while the katty has 7, but the katyusha doesn't need to operate at point blank range.
Cons and Grens are both about equal in mid range, the Katyusha and Pwerfer should be about equal at mid range, which they aren't. The pwerfer is fine to be better up close and the Kat farther back, but right now we have it were the Pwerfer can only operate at ass snifing range and the Kat is just fine at medium range.
EDIT: and Mortar's do die to stuff don't get me wrong, but they are cheaper and more disposable. |
So are mortars and the closer you put them, the more effective they are.
Scatter you know, if you want to hit things reliably, you need to be in certain distance to do so.
But mortars are 240 MP units that were designed for close artillery support. They also don't die in 1 shot (normally) to AT guns and Tanks.
The Pwerf should just operate at the same range as the Stuka and Kat, and both the Pwerf and Kat should have 240 health as well as be somewhat proof to small arms fire (but not totally, the stuka isn't totally). |
I'm quite positive you confused me with yourself here lil boy.
Its also quite adorable to see old troll already hugging new troll, showing him all the bridges and how to spit bile, always heartwarming to see the species take care of their young.
Now back on topic, there is absolutely nothing wrong with Ost panther stats, blitz was always a problem and will be a problem as long as it provides raw speed bonus on top of additional rec acc benefits not to mention acceleration, which ensures that its intended weakness-getting flanked and rear armor hits-is pretty much impossible to exploit because of its speed.
When it comes to OKW panther, its great strength comes from timing-there is absolutely nothing on field that would contest it or even prove to be a lethal danger.
Except at OKW's 66% fuel income the Panther will be coming out the same time as the second Sherman or first Jackson.
It's flabbergasting honestly that people have forgotten that the Panther used to never be built because people don't want to pay 175 fuel for a unit that can't do it's job. Because of teching costs it's the most expensive Ostheer tank in the game.
The first OKW Panther costs 255 fuel (80+175), the first Sherman costs 190 (110+80) fuel. So that's a 65 fuel difference, so of course there is going to be a gap in preformance.
The big issue with the OKW Panther is that it should cost more MP in order to encourage less infantry spam. If you increased it's MP cost by 50% it would be 735 MP, which would force you to chose between Obers and Panthers. |
And it will still kill the seagulls and maxims horribly and then come around again since it loiters and hit your tanks in one pass unless its an is2.
Are you seriously saying this ability wont target tanks over infantry? it targets and murders everything in sight...
please...i've been on the other side of this bs many times and i could have a popcap amount of infantry nearby and itll still wipe my tanks in one pass.
It has issues with targeting is all I'm saying, I can deal with the seagull and maxims myself, I don't need my expensive anti tank strafe shooting at shit other than the IS2's and Scotts I need dead.
What it targets is entirely up the RNG/Bug gods, who are often quite fickle.
It's a great ability, but it really doesn't need a nerf with the AA HT can shoot it down quickly and it costs a significant amount of munitions. Soviets DO need some better AA tho. |
This is a awesome thread.
Someone posts about the good and bad points of the Panther, then out of the woodwork every Axis only player comes to its gallant defense.
The bias is so strong here.
Blitz just needs to be fixed.
Also.
In what world is a greater than 50% chance to pen frontally at max range not easy? Does noone remember when the ZiS couldn't even pen the front armor of a PIV? |
At least the close air support doctrine abilities can be dodged.
That CAS from lightning war is funny because you cant dodge it and it comes with a Tiger. im surprised more people arent complaining about that one.
Because you can't pick what it fires at, and it adores firing at passing seagulls and maxims instead of IS2's. |
Nerf that thing which struggles to fight off Schreck blobs like the rest of them while Tigers are benefiting a ton from squad-bunching??
IS2's are potent because they can bounce shreks easily. It's also are the fastest heavy in the game outside the Panther and KV1.
The IS2 doesn't need a nerf, the Panther doesn't need a nerf, Ost just needs the Pak40 to not die in one hit and USF just needs a better AT gun.
175 fuel is not enough for what you get. If they want to lower its armor to say 250 and its fuel cost to 150 I am fine with that.
In the end its a special snowflake with a collection of all the best attributes of all Armor in game save for only having Mediocre (not non existant) AI.
250 would give it worse armor than the KV1, which only costs 45 fuel and doesn't need teching. It would also be retardedly easy to kill with Jacksons and SU-85s.
The last time the Panther had it's cost reduced but it was nerfed literally nooone built it. We don't need to go back to that. |
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You also keep discounting the cost, that 175 fuel means he won't be getting anything else for a while, and for Ostheer it means they cannot produce heavies and they would have had to skip mediums in order to get it out in time. |
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