Profile of reefermadness

I don't see a Relic dev in this thread and I don't see anything definitive. Relic said they weren't really planning on having the m26 in the game. But that doesn't mean they can't change their mind

Duffy's interview said nothing about having a heavy tank in the future (or not having a heavy tank in the future). AFAWK the door is open, especially given their willingness to experiment.

It's silly to have a faction without a single heavy tank, even if it is the jumbo. Imagine a faction without artillery or elite infantry. USF only have 1 call in doctrinal elite infantry, but they do have it.


I'm not sure a unit that was used only once fits well into this game. That said, the Sturmtiger is close

GameSpot: So tell me about the two new factions coming in The Western Front Armies.

Quinn Duffy: We have two new armies that have designed from the ground up, the US Forces and German OberKommando West, so a new American army and a new German army. The American army is very flexible, versatile, and focuses on mobility. They don’t have anything too hard-hitting, but they do have a lot of gameplay elements built around their versatility and mobility. The OKW, on the other hand, are extremely hard-hitting with a lot of veteran infantry units, super heavy tanks, and technological advances--but they're also a hard army to sustain because their economy was under a lot of pressure at this point in the war.

That was our starting point for these armies in terms of making them feel unique compared to the other armies in the game.

It's not that silly considering that they have planned this faction design along with OKW's since they started developing the expansion. The entire idea behind US Army was that it didn't really have the capability to go toe to toe with the armor of the OKW. They wanted to emphasize the fact that the U.S Army was not as well trained or equipped to fight the OKW but through the U.S being so versatile and mobile is the reason they were able to compete and win.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-05-29-relics-five-year-plan-for-company-of-heroes-2

In the 5 year plan and just about any article you read about the Western Front Armies, describes the "opinionated" statement that the new factions have specific designs to them and adding a pershing would go against the entire faction design for the United States Army. So, once again, I am going to say that they are probably not going to get this.

Search Hands on the Western Front Armies in this forum and you'll find 5 articles saying the same thing.

Adding a U.S. heavy tank would just tip the scales of balance. As it is and as it should be, it's hard to kill a King Tiger if the opponent isn't a moron. That thing can soak up a lot of damage. The only way to beat it is generally combined arms w/ flanking vehicles. Adding a heavy tank, somewhat similar to a tiger/is2 would make late german armor not as scary, which again, is the whole point of OKW late game, veteran units with heavy tanks.

Relic has said that the Pershing or a heavy tank is not something they want the new American army to have. So I doubt we will see it.

To the OP it wouldn't bring a lot of "new" strategies. It'd be back to EFA in COH2 with Tiger call ins vs 85s. T1-T2 into call ins.

Imagine if USF could just spam riflemen with zooks/bars until they got a pershing to "act as a meatshield" as the infantry just rapes all vehicles in the vicinity.

Just no.

Let's just ignore the fact that the katyusha takes more fuel to acquire than a stuka. Let's ignore the fact that it's a tier 4 vehicle vs a tier 2 stuka, a tier that was universally ignored as a waste of fuel.

"it's fine man, just don't blob"

I'm assuming you're talking about T4 soviets. I think the Kat should stay as put because it brings units that are never used back into the game.

... Except one is more expensive, with a viciously longer cool down, and with one volley instead of four?

Where do you get these comparisons?

Even if you ignore all those glaringly valid points, you still have the fact that neither Allie faction is based on setting up a forward operation. So if you get wrecked by a stuka you're just blobbing. If a katyusha fires on an OKW deployed truck, it's gone in 2 (incredibly short) cooldowns and everything around it is too, rendering null any attempts to save it.

Stuka = 200 MP + 40 Fuel + 390 MP + 100 Fuel

Kat = 200+ MP 40 Fuel (T2) + 240+ mp + 120~ fuel (T4) + 200+ MP + 85~ fuel (Kat)

One you can get relatively early compared to sort of late because of other upgrades/uses of fuel that are needed in a game. Stuka can do just as much damage as the Kat.

No But Seriously.

I have played now over a 100 games with OKW in 1v1. Here is my thoughts.

The game starts out as an upward battle. Sturmpios are great in some situations are the main DPS at the start. But its not long untill you start getting overwhelmed by rifles or scripts.

You can try and go the volks route, but they just do not cut it. The grenades are great, but you must first use 200 mp and 40 fuel to unlock them, and 30 munitions is a hefty price considering the resources the OKW get. Also if you use grenades you are left with no munitions for shreks or mines and will get torn apart by vehicles of any kind.

Kubelwagon. Yeah its great at the start, you lose capping power, you spend alot of time microing and 90% of games it will die within 5 mins due to an M3, M10, at nade or jst small arms fire.

Sturmpio's, making more than 2 is just a huge manpower drain, they take forever to build and reinforce too.

Callin's are your best friend really, access to real MG's and decent infantry. Making OKW abit like Soviets in that they are commander reliant.

Anyway the main trouble i have is the fact you have to choose between AI or AT. If there are rifles everywhere all armed with LMG's or Shocks running around chewing you up. Your choices to counter them all cost fuel.

1.)Tech to T3 and get Stuka or Flak.

2.)Tech to T4 and get Obers or Sturmtiger.

This leaves you with only 2 AT options early on, Shreks and Raktenwerfers. Neither of these are reliable AT. (Arguments incoming.....) No but seriously, the raktenwerfer unless garrisoned is killed soo easily. (also dies in houses pretty easy too) Shrek volks, well it's 90 Munitions that translates into 135 due to 66% income. For 1 Shrek!

So if you decide to go AI you leave yourself vunerable to Armour.

You could choose to go AT instead.

1.)Grab yourself an early couple of Pumas.

2.)Skip tech and jst get a couple of jagdpanzers.

3.)Or save the whole game to get a panther.

All of these options leave you totally vunerable to Infantry.

I find myself holding out the whole game to get a KingTiger every game because i want something that has AI and AT. Just like a Sherman, T34 85 or Tiger.

This is my opinion on the problems OKW have at the moment. And the Ladders don't lie.

It is an up hill battle from the start, as it's designed to be. From what I take from all these threads complaining about OKW's under strength is that some people have trouble adapting to new strategies that don't involve building 3-4 of the same unit and have them do everything you need.

To your claim that volks don't do anything I just have to flat out disagree. If volks are so terrible, how come any stream I watch from a decent player, they have 2-3 volks every game?

Yes their nades aren't as good against a unit in the open, but they just buffed it for more damage in houses. It works great, and comes with the first tier building I believe. Which is all you really need. The first building. Volks work great in houses and even in the open.

Don't skip the medic building ever. Keep your units healed and reinforced and they will vet very quickly.

As someone said, they eliminated the munitions 66% income, it's now 100% and is now viable to throw grenades at garrisons.

How'd you let someone get an M10 in 5 minutes. You lose capping power with the M3 as well, seeing as how you need a squad inside, meaning you have 2 units in one place. Aka lost capping power. Kubelwagon is hard to use, but definitely usable. It's a mobile supression platform and works great. Just keep it supported. Agree that it'll die rather quick as the game progresses but i've seen some get to vet 5.

2 Sturmpios are all you need. Mostly just for minesweepers and some nice CQC. Keep them paired with a volk with a shrek is what I like to do.

Isn't that what a doctrine is for? You pick it in the beginning of the game and develop a strategy around it or you pick it once you see their strategy and design yours around theirs? I rely on fallschrims to spawn behind maxims.

9/10 times I go for AT first. I haven't had too many people try to blob things up on me and I relied on my infantry to handle the AI. Vetted OKW infy just gets harder and harder to kill on top of the fact they cloak, run faster outta combat and heal. Fallschrims tear apart infantry coming toward them and even do decent damage up close.

Neither ONE of those are viable AT but when combined are pretty decent at keeping enemy vehicle at bay. Raketenwerfer is awesome first of all. It can get inside a building. It vets quickly and combined with a shrek, it'll do some decent damage on medium tanks. As I said, i'd also have a puma so any smart player would typically stay away from the house with an AT inside. They might die easy but they can retreat, which is something you should do before they are ontop of you.

I think your mistake is getting a "couple" of pumas. Stick with 1. They do decent on their own, have smoke and can really flank behind tanks. I keep the puma and hold out for the panther.

No offense but this isn't a balance discussion, this is you asking for more wehrmacht units. E.G an MG/pak40 etc. USF can't heal unless they have the ambo out. OKW can heal just by having veterancy and not being in combat. They can fucking cloak just because they got a star or two of vet. They can cloak in cover anywhere, that's so lulzy for raketenwerfers or sturmpios lurking somewhere. OKW is meant to have a close knit early game from what i've taken from it and people just wanna be able to run over the map with volks expecting to go toe to toe with USF rifles.