Is OKW the Final Boss In This Game?

Because my god is it incredibly hard to fight against OKW and I don't see any sign that this is changing? Having a better early game then USF, but also the best mid and late game then all other factions? I'm honestly surprised that the Luches isn't getting touched despite the fact it hits the field at like 6:30 minutes and will never ever die unless the OKW player stops paying attention(Despite numbers saying opposite the luches turns almost instantly...?). I know this patch is supposed to only balance team games and some commanders but luches rush exists in that mode too and having to deal with 4 Luches going mach speed destroying everything is a nightmare. If the patch goes through with its FRP nerfs, then you bet your ass that people will stop going med bunkers and start going even more mechanized.

Then say I don't know they fix Airborne and it becomes a really good commander. I ain't going Airborne against a luches rush. I'll probably be behind and yet again be forced to go armor company to come back.

I mean when you think about it, they have got the best of everything. Soon they will have smoke on their ISGs that will get rid of their suppression weakness. I'm not exaggerating either, the only thing they don't have is caches, and salvaging vehicles is free and provides a good amount of fuel resource.

"But but usf is OP" - Dane

this timing for luch was always like that. Even faster if i remember correctly.

OKW is faction to allows you to recover from most mistakes.

Bad commander pick ? No worries you still have kingtiger

Bad start ? No worries you can call in panther on steroids

Need to finish you enemy but lack fuel to tech? No worries, call in Ostwind.

Losing engagements? No worries volks will outpower anything I the late game thanks vet5 and lava nades.

Luchs is threatened ? No worries you have also counter to all Luchs counters in the same tier - puma

Flanked? No worries, just retreat AT guns.

Losing fights because of superior positioning ? No worries, just spend 15 munition not nuke nades

And so on and so forth

"But but usf is OP" - Dane

He's right, what's even more overpowered are Ostheer's medkits. You can heal a whole squad for 20 munitions! Why wouldn't you do that instead of building a permanent healing bunker for 60 munitions.

Seriously though what Dane doesn't understand is that USF has a lot of tools but not "Necessary" tools. They are a faction that has a lot of micro tools and abilities to pull off some really cool stuff, but they lack key tools that other factions have. Late game In-direct fire(without commander) for example, no amount of micro can make up for not having that tool.

Late game In-direct fire(without commander) for example, no amount of micro can make up for not having that tool.

And the fact that only way how to fight off feeded vet5 squads is heavy indirect fire doesn't help the fact either

He's right, what's even more overpowered are Ostheer's medkits. You can heal a whole squad for 20 munitions! Why wouldn't you do that instead of building a permanent healing bunker for 60 munitions.

Seriously though what Dane doesn't understand is that USF has a lot of tools but not "Necessary" tools. They are a faction that has a lot of micro tools and abilities to pull off some really cool stuff, but they lack key tools that other factions have. Late game In-direct fire(without commander) for example, no amount of micro can make up for not having that tool.

OKW going Defensive and putting a Pak43 and/or Howitzer around their Flak HQ, good luck breaking that without the RNG bombs of Armor being guided by Yahveh himself, while they wait for their KT.

OKW going Defensive and putting a Pak43 and/or Howitzer around their Flak HQ, good luck breaking that without the RNG bombs of Armor being guided by Yahveh himself, while they wait for their KT.

Either one of allied teammates will chose niche doctrine with ability to counter pak43 or you can say gg. Tis puts you into lose-lose situation because you will already be disadvantaged if you have to chose nich commander for example against tiger or jagtiger. And it's not like OkW cannot get best A++ heavy tank and best A++ tank destroyers only because it picked "niche doctrine"

It's okay, OKW is hamstrung by the MG34 and have to suffer with a HMG that only suppresses and doesn't do much damage. So there's that!

Whenver i face 4 okw or 1 super defensive one i always go with the soviet commander that has the IL 2 call in, recon and ML-20. Tears through all their stuff like butter.

It's okay, OKW is hamstrung by the MG34 and have to suffer with a HMG that only suppresses and doesn't do much damage. So there's that!

I also don't get that complaint. I buy an MG42 because I want it to supress quickly I don't care how much damage it does. If I want damage I'll get an infantry squad to do it. (Of course cases like the DSHKA doing both are inexcusable)

I think some of the biggest problems are really the kubel(specifially vs USF) and the volks.

Im very happy to see the kubel being adjusted so it takes longer to repair and ceeds more veterancy to units.

Regarding Volks, their amaing grenades, good at every range weapon upgrade and scaling potential make them basically elite infantry coming from your hq.

So im constructive ill suggest giving sturmpioneers flame grenades. That will make the mainline volks easier to fight by making them shoot at units in cover rather than a unit that can deny it.. You will still be able to fight garrisions with the sturm flame grenades. just an off the top of my head suggestion, but changes should be made somewhere.


Regarding USF i think the biggest issue is that they were "strong" when they had impact light vehicles like the stuart and m20, but with these much weaker it's much harder to control the midgame when your infantry is just on par with others $ for $ and you were forced into purchasing 3 of them by having no great other options at the start of the game. Hopefully this can be improved by some commander adjustments. possibly making the greyhound and other light callins available through tech earlier. But it would also be easier to get out your tanks if volks and kubels didn't slow you down as much early on.

TLDR; Kubels are changing, volks should too. USF light vehicles worse rifles cant pick up slack.

TLDR; Kubels are changing, volks should too. USF light vehicles worse rifles cant pick up slack.

That's a good point Hon3y. If OKW didn't have such an oppressive first 5 minutes it may not be so bad to see a luches coming because you would have time to prepare. However the luches IS a problem. It single handedly dictates what your opponent is going to build. Did you watch VonIvon's hilarious stream the other day when he tried going USF non-meta? He got destroyed so hard it was sad(and funny).

Luches is so dangerous that it forces USF go to Captain, Bazookas, AT gun anything that can deter it(Right now it's go LT & bazookas and PRAY you can hold out because LT gives you a chance against his infantry). British HAVE to go AEC or get Luches rushed into their base. Soviets HAVE to go SU-76.

You are also right as well. When USF had dangerously strong stuart or M20 it was their time to continue their all in pressure. Now when the M20 comes out it gets destroyed by the Luches and the Stuart is just a Luches detterent (good luck diving the thing).

My point is the Luches single handedly dictates the meta. Every factions build order is made in prediction of it. Hell I've seen people get an AT gun even when OKW went med bunker because the USF player was too scared and just assumed the OKW player went Luches.

OKW going Defensive and putting a Pak43 and/or Howitzer around their Flak HQ, good luck breaking that without the RNG bombs of Armor being guided by Yahveh himself, while they wait for their KT.

LOL, don't blame OKW if you choose wrong commanders, or your teammates suck. Jesus.

Probably you don't even know hot to smoke a unit?

LOL, don't blame OKW if you choose wrong commanders, or your teammates suck. Jesus.

Probably you don't even know hot to smoke a unit?

how*

It's okay, OKW is hamstrung by the MG34 and have to suffer with a HMG that only suppresses and doesn't do much damage. So there's that!

OKW doesnt need stronger HMG, its best supression platform in the game (after OST hmg). And once you suppress infantry all you need to do is close in with volks or throw asscheap 15 munny nades. Will work just fine.

Tell me why OKW deserves better HMG when this is already the best HMG they can think off

LOL, don't blame OKW if you choose wrong commanders, or your teammates suck. Jesus.

Probably you don't even know hot to smoke a unit?

USF: I have glaring weaknesses and if I don't pick specific commanders I'm fucked!

OKW: lol


That's one of my points, if you make 2 more USF commanders good, they can be good but it probably won't matter.

That's a good point Hon3y. If OKW didn't have such an oppressive first 5 minutes it may not be so bad to see a luches coming because you would have time to prepare. However the luches IS a problem. It single handedly dictates what your opponent is going to build. Did you watch VonIvon's hilarious stream the other day when he tried going USF non-meta? He got destroyed so hard it was sad(and funny).

Luches is so dangerous that it forces USF go to Captain, Bazookas, AT gun anything that can deter it(Right now it's go LT & bazookas and PRAY you can hold out because LT gives you a chance against his infantry). British HAVE to go AEC or get Luches rushed into their base. Soviets HAVE to go SU-76.

You are also right as well. When USF had dangerously strong stuart or M20 it was their time to continue their all in pressure. Now when the M20 comes out it gets destroyed by the Luches and the Stuart is just a Luches detterent (good luck diving the thing).

My point is the Luches single handedly dictates the meta. Every factions build order is made in prediction of it. Hell I've seen people get an AT gun even when OKW went med bunker because the USF player was too scared and just assumed the OKW player went Luches.

If okw don't go for luchs it will get rekt by riflemen. It's like the same thing as preparing for a clown car, bren carrier, etc., there is no counter for it, but to buy raketen.

Reason for luch, is because it's the only way to survive, like you said, when VonIvan went non USF meta he got rekt. Luch is meta for OKW. Play non meta OKW and get destroyed.

LOL, don't blame OKW if you choose wrong commanders, or your teammates suck. Jesus.

Yes, OKW player has never blamed his wrong commander choice because no matter what he choses he will have

• Best Heavy Tank
  
• Strong Mainline and Elite Infantry
  
• Strong Indirect Fire
  
• Best Tank Destroyers
  
• FRP and Emplacement (FlakHQ)
  
• Mines
  
• Garrison Counters (now even smoke)
  
• Cover Building Options
  
• Light Vehicle
  
• Light AT Vehicle
  
• Strong Medium Tank
  
• Vet 5
  
• and All Weapon Teams (some factions won't have access to most team weapons if they chose wrong tech path)
  
  

If okw don't go for luchs it will get rekt by riflemen. It's like the same thing as preparing for a clown car, bren carrier, etc., there is no counter for it, but to buy raketen.

Reason for luch, is because it's the only way to survive, like you said, when VonIvan went non USF meta he got rekt. Luch is meta for OKW. Play non meta OKW and get destroyed.

The thing is that OKW kit as it stands is so complete that Commanders for them are boosts, not there to fill in holes in the faction which in turns give them more versatility than USF, which is supposed to be one of their strengths much like Early Game when OKW can spank you silly Early Game and then Late Game as well.