If relic were to employ a fan, who would be the best pick?

None of us knew what kind of successes esports was going to take in 2012/2013.

There was a high likelihood that Company of Heroes 2 would've never existed. That's something to think about. Because, you know, we were all very close to not having a community at all.

Brad already posted in this thread that he listens to particular experts in the community already, so don't imply that they aren't listening to people in an attempt to improve. You clearly were wondering why they weren't listening to your ideas in particular, so don't try to make your problems the community's problems. Again, I seriously doubt they're ignoring your ideas to be spiteful, the realistic approach says they're not pursuing your ideas because its unrealistic at the moment. So yeah, you've pretty much gotta throw ideas at the wall if you think it'll help, and sometimes it gets pursued, sometimes not. Just stop expecting a medal in the mail every time you come up with a winning idea a few teenagers on the internet agree with.

you must be one of the guys thats satisfied with coh2 as it is, and satisfied with the direction, or lack thereof that they are going in

Brad already posted in this thread that he listens to particular experts in the community already, so don't imply that they aren't listening to people in an attempt to improve. You clearly were wondering why they weren't listening to your ideas in particular, so don't try to make your problems the community's problems. Again, I seriously doubt they're ignoring your ideas to be spiteful, the realistic approach says they're not pursuing your ideas because its unrealistic at the moment. So yeah, you've pretty much gotta throw ideas at the wall if you think it'll help, and sometimes it gets pursued, sometimes not. Just stop expecting a medal in the mail every time you come up with a winning idea a few teenagers on the internet agree with.

i reread what you posted and thought about it and it does look like im bitching about only my idea. i apologize.

Its not what im trying to drive at.

you must be one of the guys thats satisfied with coh2 as it is, and satisfied with the direction, or lack thereof that they are going in

I literally don't give any shits about coh2, and respect the people that do anything at all considering how little Relic can do anything about what they ask for.

I literally don't give any shits about coh2, and respect the people that do anything at all considering how little Relic can do anything about what they ask for.

genuinely curious, then why are you posting on coh2.org if you dont care

I have no doubts Brad listens to the players he mentioned and also reads the forums. He was excellent in all the alphas and pre release testing.

What the real issue is that the higher ups probably won't allow him to be as radical as he wants and also don't like players helping with their game.

There was a common thread during pre release testing when I was involved. There were some brilliant community modders involved who were able to fix many bugs just using Attribute Editor alone but their fix proposals were either ignored or fobbed off with the usual can't dedicate QA time to the fix.

This left some really irksome bugs in the game for months on end when the solutions were discovered before the patch hit the live build.

It just supports my view that the higher ups at Relic are simply too arrogant to take suggestions and help from the mere players.

genuinely curious, then why are you posting on coh2.org if you dont care

I play the game I just don't care what direction it goes in.

I have no doubts Brad listens to the players he mentioned and also reads the forums. He was excellent in all the alphas and pre release testing.

What the real issue is that the higher ups probably won't allow him to be as radical as he wants and also don't like players helping with their game.

There was a common thread during pre release testing when I was involved, there were some brilliant modders involved who were able to fix many bugs just using Attribute Editor alone but their fix proposals were either ignored or fobbed off with the usual can't dedicate QA time to the fix.

This left some really irksome bugs in the game for months on end when the solutions were discovered before the patch hit the live build.

It just supports my view that the higher ups at Relic are simply too arrogant to take suggestions and help from the mere players.

Honestly they'd be doing themselves a favor if they stopped talking to you altogether. I don't think you take enough of the blame for how long it took ESL to take off. Thank god you stepped down.

Don't try to make it Relic v. Brad here. It's really Relic v. the engine they're stuck with at this point. If there's any takeaway from the vet crisis it's the fact that Relic is up against some legacy code with faulty iterative processes for troubleshooting and managing bugs. Relic as a whole is at fault, and Brad already said he's willing to take the blame for the issues.

Relic as a whole is at fault, and Brad already said he's willing to take the blame for the issues.

Brad shouldent take all of it. Whoever is at the top is responsible. Like you said if brad is working with whatever hes given then its not his fault if higher ups wont let the guys trying to make the game better do anything.

PS, im blown away you dont care what direction the game goes in, they could make pios destroy tanks and paint all the buildings orange and neon yellow and youd just keep playing??

Honestly they'd be doing themselves a favor if they stopped talking to you altogether. I don't think you take enough of the blame for how long it took ESL to take off. Thank god you stepped down.

It was one of the most popular amateur leagues on the site before I stopped working on the game. I had no prizes to give out (yes even the ESL premium prizes were stopped), no promotion on social media. If I had done a bad job I wouldn't have won admin of the month and be promoted to European Staff Head in less than a year.

Then again I shouldn't take lectures from someone who embezzled $5000 USD of cash that was meant to be used for tournament prize money.

Brad shouldent take all of it. Whoever is at the top is responsible. Like you said if brad is working with whatever hes given then its not his fault if higher ups wont let the guys trying to make the game better do anything.

PS, im blown away you dont care what direction the game goes in, they could make pios destroy tanks and paint all the buildings orange and neon yellow and youd just keep playing??

fuck man at that point I'd stop playing but come on they'll obviously never do that just because I stop giving a shit

I'm eager to blame the higher-ups too, but the community as a whole really only has what's been said so far to go off of. Anything else is hearsay and assumptions, neither of which I recommend the community give any credibility. Especially when the dude making such accusations (ipkai) has done plenty of harm to the community already by being an unflexible nincompoop.

ok i dont wana be a part of a thread thats just people insulting each other, ive said what i needed to say and then some, im tapping out

None of us knew what kind of successes esports was going to take in 2012/2013.

There was a high likelihood that Company of Heroes 2 would've never existed. That's something to think about. Because, you know, we were all very close to not having a community at all.

When CoH2 was released, SC2 had been out for 3 years and had an immensely popular e-sports scene, Valve had run TI1 and TI2 for Dota 2, and TI3 was right around the corner with almost $3 million in prizes. It was very obvious this whole e-sports thing was going to be a success.

The reason CoH2 is what it is is almost certainly because the only way Relic could get a CoH sequel green-lit from THQ was to come up with a monetization scheme that gave them the ability to fund constant development. I highly doubt anybody on Relic's design team has ever been excited about the prospect of designing a game that revolved around DLC commanders (especially since multiple designers very publicly denied that DLC would have any impact on gameplay before release), and they've been trying pretty damn hard to work around that critical design flaw ever since.

At this point it's too late to fix the game's core problems. The best anyone can hope for is an effective bandaid. I don't really think it's a people problem, more an unfortunate combination of bad circumstances and procedural issues. There's too much technical and design debt at this point to expect major modifications.

It was one of the most popular amateur leagues on the site before I stopped working on the game. I had no prizes to give out (yes even the ESL premium prizes were stopped), no promotion on social media. If I had done a bad job I wouldn't have won admin of the month and be promoted to European Staff Head in less than a year.

Then again I shouldn't take lectures from someone who embezzled $5000 USD of cash that was meant to be used for tournament prize money.

Reading that first paragraph is hilarious. You dream all that up yourself?

That second paragraph is made-up. You know for a fact it was $500 and I gave it all back. You're going off of the projected price of all those posters, which ended up just being given away to winners of SNF. All of which I gave back. Still got me kicked from admin, because I still wanted to be responsible and felt bad about the whole ordeal. Plus, it was 4 years ago. April 11, 2012, as a matter of fact. Look it up.

ok i dont wana be a part of a thread thats just people insulting each other, ive said what i needed to say and then some, im tapping out

I'm sorry whiteflash if anything I said to you felt personal, I didn't intend for it to.

Not apologizing to Ipkai though I inteded for that to be personal.

I'm sorry whiteflash if anything I said to you felt personal, I didn't intend for it to.

Not apologizing to Ipkai though I inteded for that to be personal.

nah, its you and ipkai

i wanted to stay on topic like inverse was doing in post #152

That's like your opinion man. I have no regrets and I'm happy with what I did, wish I could have done more but I got burnt out.

Sorry that I derailed the topic. I won't post anymore in here.

I think it would be unfair to try to say it's Brad v relic OR relic v engine. Personally I'd say everyone could probably get their fair share of blame but ultimately its the higher ups that decide what gets approved and what doesnt.

Edit: at the end of the day though a lot of community suggestions (some of my own and some forum suggestions) have been implemented, and I can genuinely say I enjoy playing the game

well I wish Relic the best, I don't know if hiring community people is a real good idea, but contracting cruzzi for like a month or so?

Relic was spoiled by people like Kolaris who basically patched and fixed the game. Kolaris help!

Serious props for the frequent recent patches Relic, love to see it

Yea the game is still pretty bad.

Lets see....

Vickers MG still does too much dmg

Bofors is still....wtf, penetrates heavy armor?? seriously guys get your shit together there

you guys keep releasing doctrines that promote sim city...i dont mind a little of it but....your incentivising people to COMMIT to sim city, almost no one enjoys that kind of gameplay. do you WANT people to enjoy coh2 less?? with commanders like this it sure seems that way

Ya know looking at my post im realizing its brits that mostly ruined coh2...just like coh1!

oh and why are axis allowed to have more than 1 KT in a single match?

Nice job gents