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ESL Go4COH2 cups

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2 Jan 2016, 18:07 PM
#61
avatar of Yukiko
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Posts: 2454 | Subs: 2


And chance that some of these matches (good player against good player in fisrt round is)

will be really big.

if im not wrong with my math (whitch im not going to describe here , it will took some place , if somebody will want that math then tell me i can tell you my thoughts , and you can correct me if im wrong.)

The chance is horrible 51,56027 % cca

And that is more than a lot


Hmm, show me the math then! How do you reason through to that answer?
2 Jan 2016, 18:10 PM
#62
avatar of luvnest
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Patrion 39

Posts: 1094 | Subs: 20


Now for the topic that interests me the most. What's the min/max time for a single match in everyone's opinion?


Thank you for answering the questions. Min/Max time for matches is really hard to predict. A match between evenly skilled players can go up to one hour or end after less than ten minutes. I'd say the average is ~20 minutes.
2 Jan 2016, 21:50 PM
#63
avatar of Waffleticket

Posts: 65

Can't we have the tournaments on Sunday start earlier? like 2:00 EST?



Thank you for answering the questions. Min/Max time for matches is really hard to predict. A match between evenly skilled players can go up to one hour or end after less than ten minutes. I'd say the average is ~20 minutes.


This is pretty spot on.

2 Jan 2016, 23:53 PM
#64
avatar of ShadowDraft

Posts: 5

Can't we have the tournaments on Sunday start earlier? like 2:00 EST?


I can't really decide that for NA but I'll ask the one in charge if that would be possible.


Also thanks for the info about possible match runtime. That's actually quite helpful.
3 Jan 2016, 00:18 AM
#65
avatar of IpKaiFung
Benefactor 115

Posts: 1708 | Subs: 2

I'm quite intrigued that ESL chose not to consult with the person who used to run the CoH2 section a year or so ago.
3 Jan 2016, 04:14 AM
#66
avatar of chef_of_death

Posts: 71



Thank you for answering the questions. Min/Max time for matches is really hard to predict. A match between evenly skilled players can go up to one hour or end after less than ten minutes. I'd say the average is ~20 minutes.




+1
3 Jan 2016, 13:47 PM
#67
avatar of AmiPolizeiFunk
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Posts: 16697 | Subs: 12

Proof in the pudding:

  • Luvnest vs. Sprice in Round 1, one of these great players will be gone after the first game of the tourney.

  • The hard bracket: After 3 Best-of-1 rounds, three of these four will be gone: Luvnest, Sprice, FaHu, HelpingHans.

  • The top bracket (Jesulin, Vindicare) is much easier than the bottom bracket (Luvnest, Sprice, Hans, Cruzz, BartonPL).


I want to be excited about these events but not seeding them is just wack. :facepalm:
3 Jan 2016, 14:38 PM
#68
avatar of ShadowDraft

Posts: 5

Proof in the pudding:

  • Luvnest vs. Sprice in Round 1, one of these great players will be gone after the first game of the tourney.

  • The hard bracket: After 3 Best-of-1 rounds, three of these four will be gone: Luvnest, Sprice, FaHu, HelpingHans.

  • The top bracket (Jesulin, Vindicare) is much easier than the bottom bracket (Luvnest, Sprice, Hans, Cruzz, BartonPL).


I want to be excited about these events but not seeding them is just wack. :facepalm:


Well it will be seeded after this cup.

Also sorry to any players about the confusion with the automated closing. That's fixed for round 32 and upcoming ones.
3 Jan 2016, 14:55 PM
#69
avatar of Waffleticket

Posts: 65

Quick question: What happens if a player is dropped from the server? I can't seem to find a rule about it.
3 Jan 2016, 15:33 PM
#70
avatar of ShadowDraft

Posts: 5

Quick question: What happens if a player is dropped from the server? I can't seem to find a rule about it.


I've been holding that as we would do in other games: Technical difficulties are the players responsibility.

But in case the match has not progressed to far you may have a gentlemans agreement to rematch.
3 Jan 2016, 19:51 PM
#71
avatar of luvnest
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Posts: 1094 | Subs: 20

Good games overall. The Best of 3 map/faction choice system is extremely shitty though. Basically losing the coin toss is a major disadvantage since your opponent can always counter pick.

So if you lose the coin toss in for the first game and lose the game, you basically get counterpicked twice which is not fair at all. Why not use the orignal set up where you change positions and faction in a BO3.

Btw, the fixed starting postitions still didn't have any additional information which was a shame. Apparently the guy with the map choice had to pick the side aswell.
4 Jan 2016, 11:09 AM
#72
avatar of Tittendachs

Posts: 115

Congratulations to Barton and Luvnest for winning the first weekly ESL GO4 Cup!

Amazing comeback from Barton vs Cruzz, Luvnest and Jesulin! - (S)Comebackbarton :D

Hoping to see more great games next week :) Keep it up!
4 Jan 2016, 12:55 PM
#73
avatar of Waffleticket

Posts: 65

Tournament seemed to work much better this week. Congrats to everyone who won.

Good games overall. The Best of 3 map/faction choice system is extremely shitty though. Basically losing the coin toss is a major disadvantage since your opponent can always counter pick.

So if you lose the coin toss in for the first game and lose the game, you basically get counterpicked twice which is not fair at all. Why not use the orignal set up where you change positions and faction in a BO3.

Btw, the fixed starting postitions still didn't have any additional information which was a shame. Apparently the guy with the map choice had to pick the side aswell.


+1
4 Jan 2016, 14:25 PM
#74
avatar of Chexx

Posts: 6

Good games overall. The Best of 3 map/faction choice system is extremely shitty though. Basically losing the coin toss is a major disadvantage since your opponent can always counter pick.

So if you lose the coin toss in for the first game and lose the game, you basically get counterpicked twice which is not fair at all. Why not use the orignal set up where you change positions and faction in a BO3.

Btw, the fixed starting postitions still didn't have any additional information which was a shame. Apparently the guy with the map choice had to pick the side aswell.


Could you explain the starting positions a little bit more?
4 Jan 2016, 14:40 PM
#75
avatar of AmiPolizeiFunk
Admin Black Badge
Patrion 15

Posts: 16697 | Subs: 12

I agree that the cointoss + "map or faction" thing is an ok solution for Best-of-1's with no mirror matches, but I far prefer the traditional fixed positions and switching sides on the same map for a Best-of-3. At least with the traditional format, you know that it is fair, no matter how skewed the map and/or faction balance is at the time.

If you insist on switching maps in a Best-of-3, I think it should only be done in the 3rd game.
A_E
4 Jan 2016, 14:41 PM
#76
avatar of A_E
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Donator 11

Posts: 2439 | Subs: 6

So basically Relic/ESL need to realise that having pick is a disadvantage as you get counterpicked, I explained that within days of the rules being posted. The loser having pick is a disadvantage, it should be the winner, or it should be on the same map and swap axis/allies.

The fixed positions needs to say Allies start in position 1, hopefully that text gets added.
4 Jan 2016, 15:08 PM
#77
avatar of luvnest
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jump backJump back to quoted post4 Jan 2016, 14:25 PMChexx


Could you explain the starting positions a little bit more?


There are 2 player 1v1 maps (like Kholodny Ferma, Faymonville Approach, etc) and 4 player 1v1 maps (Semoisky Winter, Crossing in the Woods, etc).

So if you have fixed starting positions you also have to tell the players where Allies or Axis factions have to start. Here is an example of how it used to be for the last major event, Operation Charlie Fox:

Fixed positions (Allies in lower slots 1 or 1/2, Axis in higher slots 2 or 3/4)
In Best-of-1 mirror matches you can un-tick fixed positions.

http://www.coh2.org/topic/39043/operation-charlie-fox-official-rules


Your colleague ShadowDraft told me yesterday:
Until the rules are updated the mappick will choose his start aswell

That would work aswell of course.
4 Jan 2016, 22:44 PM
#78
avatar of Chexx

Posts: 6



There are 2 player 1v1 maps (like Kholodny Ferma, Faymonville Approach, etc) and 4 player 1v1 maps (Semoisky Winter, Crossing in the Woods, etc).

So if you have fixed starting positions you also have to tell the players where Allies or Axis factions have to start. Here is an example of how it used to be for the last major event, Operation Charlie Fox:



Your colleague ShadowDraft told me yesterday:

That would work aswell of course.


Is it always 1,2 for allies and 3,4 for axis on every map?
4 Jan 2016, 23:15 PM
#79
avatar of IpKaiFung
Benefactor 115

Posts: 1708 | Subs: 2

not always. I used to use these positions for the following maps

Kholodny Ferma (Axis Positions 1&2, Allies Positions 3&4)
Kholodny Ferma Winter (Axis Positions 1&2, Allies Positions 3&4)
Langreskaya (Axis Positions 1&2, Allies Positions 3&4)

some deliberation may be required as the maps have been adjusted since I made that rule set.
A_E
4 Jan 2016, 23:18 PM
#80
avatar of A_E
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Donator 11

Posts: 2439 | Subs: 6

not always. I used to use these positions for the following maps

Kholodny Ferma (Axis Positions 1&2, Allies Positions 3&4)
Kholodny Ferma Winter (Axis Positions 1&2, Allies Positions 3&4)
Langreskaya (Axis Positions 1&2, Allies Positions 3&4)


I agree with these classically, although our classical ideas of campy wehrmacht vs. flanking allies is being challenged by the new meta and the post December balance changes making four of five armies viable in multiple strategies.

Tbh I think if we were doing a hypothetical super tournament with a mega prize pool right now, we'd need a proper look at it, and keep an open mind about things.
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