mines

im trying to figure it out why mines are the way they are, why russians has universal cheap spamable mine thats good vs everything, and germans has 2 types of mines that are good basicly for nothing. german anti infantry mine fields cost 80 munis, that consists of 4 mines that has a sign all over them that its mine field, im not even talking about how much time it actually takes to plant 4 mines but lets be honest at most it can kill 2 conscripts, after that enemy will just avoid this area, on top of it who can ever invest 80 munitions into such mines early game when its needed the most? why do i need to pay 80 munitions even if i need 1 mine in the area from where flank could come... having troubles with clown cars? nope u cant use mines cant afford it, got swarmed by t34's? here build this expensive mine and destroy one of them. so i just wondering what was the idea of making these mines like that, shouldnt it be the other way around, russians gets expensive mines with bigger damage vs expensive strong tanks and germans get cheaper mines with less damage vs cheap weak tanks.
i dont think there was anything wrong at all with the mines that there was in vcoh, why change something that worked perfectly for all 4 factions?

TL: DR but I think the Soviets get the more versatile mine because their anti-armor options aren't so great and the Ostheer get bunkers.

I'll be a dissenting voice and say that I don't mind that mines are not quite so spammable in CoH2 as in CoH1. By making mines less potent the flanking game has become better. I'm thinking specifically of the German mines and the Russian flanking attacks, since isn't that how it usually goes?

That said, I just played two games as Russians after playing many games as Germans. It was very much a "hello, old friend!" moment when I started planting lots of mines with my combat engineers. I actually managed to kill several armored cars and an MG, in addition to plenty of individual soldiers.

What you say about how it sucks that mines are not a good counter to scout cars + flamers/snipers is definitely true, however.

+1

They don't necessarily need to be exactly the same but playing as Ost I never use the mines. Besides being an incredibly munitions hungry faction, their options are too expensive and too unwieldy / slow / target specific. If anything it feels like the Sovs need the teller mines and the Osts need the regular ones, so maybe just reverse them.

As Sovs since they require munitions for basically nothing planting mines everywhere is pretty easy and usually to great effect.

Also, demo charges on engineers are insane in this game due to plant anywhere. Was playing a guy that would regularly put them near points and I lost several full squads in the blink of an eye as the squad would come in to cap!

Yep, mines are totally unbalanced now. As I play I rarely see Ost mines, and Sov mines are standard thing to use.
Ost should have option to use cheaper mines, and the minefield should not be marked, that is just crazy. You spend 80 munis and then the opponent sees where you planted them :/

Soviets should be mining like crazy. It's very difficult to spend their munitions quickly if they have 50% or better map control.

maybe giving grens the ability to place mines and reducing the ammo cost of teller mines and anti-personel mines a little would solve many problems currently adressed:
- m3/t70 pushing deep into wehr territory chasing retreating units
- map control of wehr on relatively big maps compared to coh 1
- more versatility on grens with synergy to wehr play
- ability of wehr to negate flanks and lock down vs ability of soviets to be mobile and push fast
- forcing soviets to use mine detectors and spend their early game ammo

... not that it hasn't been mentioned before.

For me this is the biggest mystery of CoH2, atm. Those minefields are practically useless as it takes ages to build. In an intense game there will never be time to place those minefields. Giving Ostheer "normal" mines would make much more sense and counter the M3 strategy quite well as well..

German vehicle mine insta-kills a T70. Not too shabby.

German infantry mines take too long to setup, cost too much and the damage output leaves something to be desired.

If Relic wants two different mine classes, then just make the infantry mine single use (instead of 4), make it cost the same as the Russian mine and buff it up a bit.

Sov AT mine is too efficient vs infantry.
Ost AI mine needs to be changed to a single mine placement, with optional shift queing.
Ost AT mine needs a cost reduction.

leave as is and give the Germans another option: "plant fake mine field".
for 10 muni, they only set up the signs ;-)

u can make 1 single infatry mine as osther, just cancel the building after first mine.

Although I do this sometimes, it is still bad because it means I have to float 80+ munitions when I only need 20.

u can make 1 single infatry mine as osther, just cancel the building after first mine.

Does it refund the munitions for the unplanted mines?

Yes it does. It also doesn't subtract the munitions for mines that are blocked by other objects (red) and only uses the munitions for the actually planted ones.
But you still need 80 munitions to be able to start building the field.

Each of the four fields seems to spawn four small mines in random positions around it in a radius that is marked by the warning signs just outside of it.
When you build a single field, you place 4 warning signs. If you build four fields (whole field), you still only seem to spawn 4 warning signs. Thus, manually building only single fields makes the field also much easier to notice.

Its a stupid micri requirement, and as kosi pointed out, you have to have the full sum before beginning laying.

The signs... who the fuck would sign a minefield in a frontline combat area.

Ost mines are crap, as outlined in my post above.