Ost/Sov Halftrack Veterancy

Hi all,

So, I wanted to discuss the ost/sov HT veterancy bonuses and exp requirements.

The boni (bigger reinforce circle, faster movement, greater sight) are in a good place if we consider the HT role to be reinforcement and transport. BUT, its damn near impossible to attain the veterancy for Ost & Sov HTs due to their pitiful dmg output in their default states. The solution seems to be to decrease their exp requirement BUT thats no good, because otherwise they'll get faster movement and sight with their upgrades and become all round infantry killers very quickly.

At the same time, some of the same bonuses are a bit redundant after they have upgraded with AA upgrade/Flamer upgrade (bigger sight, bigger reinforce) because they can not reinforce with upgrades.

My suggestion: How about having the upgrade convert the units into a different unit like the 221 converted into 222 with the autocannon upgrade? Is it possible that this can reset the veterancy? I'm suggesting this because the current vet requirements are fine for the upgraded HTs but not vanilla HTs. And if we lower the exp requirements so that transport HTs upgrade, that'll indirectly buff the upgraded HTs. Thus my suggestion of converting units.

TL;DR: HT veterancy is impossible to attain as transports, we need to do something. Lets brainstorm a solution so we can suggest to relic.

They are looking into it.

= never fix

They should still be able to reinforce with the weapon upgrades.

They should still be able to reinforce with the weapon upgrades.

Not with the upgraded M5 being as it is, no. THAT will only lead us back to the (cancerous) m5 meta that was all the rage some time back.

And you can't argue that for only 251 as that will be unfair

Alternative solution: remove upgrade entirely, and make upgraded HTs a separate unit with the same muni costs to build. That way both can have vet requirements and bonuses adjusted as needed. Relic already has the model assets etc., will just have to rename the 'new' units. What say you all?

Make stock versions of the 2 half tracks better at killing infantry so they aren't glorified reinforcement points. Right now if you upgrade them they can get veterancy but then you lose out on the veterancy benefits as increased reinforcement range is worthless to you.

Not with the upgraded M5 being as it is, no. THAT will only lead us back to the (cancerous) m5 meta that was all the rage some time back.

And you can't argue that for only 251 as that will be unfair

Oh no people are using an extremely expensive glass cannon to support their army.

I'll start by making the default MGs not suck.

Regarding reinforcing while upgraded: i'll go for a half way solution. Add a button which disables the weapons and let it reinforce. Just put it behind a 2min cooldown, so you can't just toggle it on and off.

I'll start by making the default MGs not suck.

Regarding reinforcing while upgraded: i'll go for a half way solution. Add a button which disables the weapons and let it reinforce. Just put it behind a 2min cooldown, so you can't just toggle it on and off.

+1 that works too.

Oh no people are using an extremely expensive glass cannon to support their army.

270/200 mp and 30 fuel is not expensive. You could argue that 120 muni is a lot for Ostheer but not for Sov, they have few muni expenses.

270/200 mp and 30 fuel is not expensive. You could argue that 120 muni is a lot for Ostheer but not for Sov, they have few muni expenses.

Molotovs, AT grenades, Oorah, Mines, Flamers, AT gun barrage, elite infantry abilities etc etc.

Soviets have plenty of places to spend munitions, as to whether or not players bother to do it is another question. If you have more than 90 munitions and you're not saving for something, you're not building enough mines, imo.

270/200 mp and 30 fuel is not expensive. You could argue that 120 muni is a lot for Ostheer but not for Sov, they have few muni expenses.

Just as many as Ost. They need to upgrade their infantry, build mines, use tons of AT grenades, etc.

Honestly, for how awesome it is the current muni price is completely justified.

Just as many as Ost. They need to upgrade their infantry, build mines, use tons of AT grenades, etc.

Honestly, for how awesome it is the current muni price is completely justified.

Sovs dont have infantry upgrades. Not without specific doctrines. And the ones they do have (guards excepted) are generally cheaper. And their mines are cheaper. I'm not commenting on the price of the upgrade, just saying that generally sov has more muni floating than ostheer. So 120 muni has different value for both the factions.

Molotovs, AT grenades, Oorah, Mines, Flamers, AT gun barrage, elite infantry abilities etc etc.

Soviets have plenty of places to spend munitions, as to whether or not players bother to do it is another question. If you have more than 90 munitions and you're not saving for something, you're not building enough mines, imo.

I, personally, agree with you that if you have more than 60 muni you ought to be mining. What I meant in my earlier post was that, faction to faction, ostheer has more muni expenses. So 120 muni has different value for both factions.

I'm not saying that ostheer is a weaker faction, nor saying that this is an imbalance. The whole point of the thread is HT veterancy. I only mentioned the upgraded variants to show that we can't just decrease the exp reqs as that will indirectly buff the upgraded HTs, nor directly add in reinforce to upgraded HTs.

elchino's idea is a good solution too.

You know that I get triggered when people tripple post instead of editing their post?

Relic said some time ago on stream that they want to check all veterancy abilities on every squad, but knowing relic and how they treated warspoils I don't believe that.

Yes, I know its a low priority issue, but it can be fixed easily, and I wanted to raise awareness of it. We can only hope the devs will see and decide to act on it someday.

I haven't really had a problem with the veterancys, of course it's hard to get them to high vet without weapon upgrades but imo this is justified

Without upgrades they're ment to be completely supportive, advance behind your troops reinforcing and dealing some dmg to troops that are closer, but with weapon upgrades they're offensive supporting tools instead of completely supportive

If they got the veterancy easier this would mean that they get vet 3 with the weapon upgrades in no time which would cause a problem in itself because of the huge veterancy boosts that the HTs get

Imo the solution should be reducing the vet requirements of the HTs, but make the upgraded HT have higher requirements (compared to this patch) and have their veterancy reset, or make the veterancy be flat so when they're upgraded and the requirements get higher, they would go from (for example) vet 2 to vet 1

Just my stupid idea but might be useful

I haven't really had a problem with the veterancys, of course it's hard to get them to high vet without weapon upgrades but imo this is justified

Without upgrades they're ment to be completely supportive, advance behind your troops reinforcing and dealing some dmg to troops that are closer, but with weapon upgrades they're offensive supporting tools instead of completely supportive

If they got the veterancy easier this would mean that they get vet 3 with the weapon upgrades in no time which would cause a problem in itself because of the huge veterancy boosts that the HTs get

Imo the solution should be reducing the vet requirements of the HTs, but make the upgraded HT have higher requirements (compared to this patch) and have their veterancy reset, or make the veterancy be flat so when they're upgraded and the requirements get higher, they would go from (for example) vet 2 to vet 1

Just my stupid idea but might be useful

I know that. Thats exactly why I suggested that upgrade should convert it into different unit with different vet bonuses and exp requirements. Though now i feel it would be easier to just have two different units with different vet bonuses and exp reqs. Probably easier coding wise, and the assets already exist.

And i know the HT are for support. If you look at their vet bonuses, those reflect that too (increased reinforce radius, faster movement, more sight) which makes it a shame that the bloody bonuses are impossible to achieve!