Suppression for Grens.. Bug/Working as intended?

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 16:08 PMAlexzandvar

You guys know how small the chance of this happening is right? The reason why it's seen on cons more often like I said is they are you easier to hit combined with the fact they have a high model count.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 16:50 PMAlexzandvar

Pretty much confirms it has a lot to due with accuracy mechanics then (incremental as well as red cover). Because the shocks armor just allows them to shrug off shots instead of avoiding them.

Also means Vetted grens will do it more often due to that sweet vet 2 +40% accuracy.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 16:26 PMBlalord

A unit under fire will stay longer suppressed, we all know that, but why the fuck can gren create a suppress, thats a mistery ... Do they have some autotesting process like we have in web development ? huge drawback : /

1-"Accuracy does not affect suppression against the squad itself, but it affects splash suppression.
Basically:

For every bullet shot at the target squad it will receive the suppression value of the bullet multiplied with the cover modifier and modifier if the squad is suppressed, regardless if it hits or not.
Suppression_amount * cover_table_entry * squad_state_entry = Suppression per shot on target squad


For every bullet hitting the target squad, it will suppress all squads in an area around it depending on the cover modifier of the targeted squad (not the ones nearby!), the state modifier (pinned/suppressed) of the targeted squad the splash modifier.
Suppression_amount * cover_table_entry * nearby_suppression_multiplier * squad_state_entry = Suppression per hit on target squad for all squads in a nearby_suppression_radius area around the squad.

Keep the "targeted" and "hit" in mind. Accuracy matters for splash suppression and both splash and target suppression depend on the cover and state of the target squad.

Complicated? A bit
Now look at what that means:

If you are shooting at a pinned/suppressed squad, others in the area will receive lower suppression!
If you have two squads as targets, one in the open, one in green cover and you shoot at the one in the open, both will quickly get suppressed. If you shoot at the one in cover, none will get suppressed.
If you fire at a house, nearby units will not receive noticeable suppression.
And now comes the really trick part where knowledge shines.
If you fire at an Oberkommando truck or a tank, it will deal no damage, but massively suppress all squads around it since usually cover, state and accuracy are all < 1. For a tank as target they are all 1, meaning you have a huge splash suppression! ;p"

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 17:46 PMelchino7

PLEASE, stop spreading bullshit if you just are not 90% sure how something works or at least have the decency of looking for stats.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 16:00 PMAerohank

It's the same reason why some people think the new HMG42 suppression is fine but the maxims suppression (or lack thereof) should not receive the same buff because flanking is apparently only something allies should have to do and mindless infantry spam is something that isn't a problem when axis do it.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 17:51 PMAlexzandvar

man i'm just trying to do my best to help figure out what the fuck is going on here, im stuck sitting in a bed with nothing to do.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 17:54 PMsiddolio

What about all the other times you tried spreading bullshit? KAPPA

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 17:41 PMiTzDusty

I love how upset people are getting over this. It rarely happens in an actual match, I had it happen once to me in 20 games last night (and it didn't make a difference).

It'll get fixed, it's not intended, and it won't make any difference in your matches.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 17:59 PMAlexzandvar

but well maybe it's the haze of the painkillers but i feel like shit that most people here just treat me like a joke despite me just being passionate about discussing things

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 18:47 PMdaspoulos

oh great incremental accuracy per model is wrecking more things than just overbuffing HMGs. change it please for gods sake.

Keep the "targeted" and "hit" in mind. Accuracy matters for splash suppression and both splash and target suppression depend on the cover and state of the target squad.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 18:02 PMTatatala

Who's upset?

Just reporting something that I found. And yes, it actually will affect your match, especially when people are blobbing grens.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:01 PMiTzDusty

It will only affect you if you aren't using cover and blobbing. So basically never unless you aren't playing well.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:01 PMiTzDusty

It will only affect you if you aren't using cover and blobbing. So basically never unless you aren't playing well.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:01 PMiTzDusty

It will only affect you if you aren't using cover and blobbing. So basically never unless you aren't playing well.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:13 PMCruzz

Glad to hear you're so good at this game you never have fights against 2 or more grenadiers (or JLI or Obers or Stormtroopers) while not being in green cover.

Blobbing makes no difference against this, except from the axis side where you will start getting aoe suppression as you gather up more and more grens. Two grens to suppress one squad, but three grens can already handle two squads.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:20 PMAlexzandvar

So do you think it's because what they did with the data files or...? Because it seems weird that we got this accuracy/mg/suppression change and this just start occurring.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:25 PMCruzz

Like I said, it's not about accuracy. Something outside of AttribArchive has changed in regards to suppression.

Game Data Organization Effort
Previously when we increased the lethality of infantry it was done with a blanket modifier of weapon accuracy and received accuracy. What we have done is adjusted the data so that the actual weapon stats are relative to its lethality. The performance of the unit and weapons are not changed. This is simply a data cleanup effort.

Removed accuracy weapon and receive accuracy modifiers that was used to increase infantry lethality and create a class type. Move respective values into the accuracy of the weapons and the size of the unit.

All HMGs
We felt blob counter units weren’t performing as well as we wanted and needed a performance boost to deal with Blobs of units better.

Incremental accuracy multiplier changed to 1.15
Incremental search radius changed to 10/12.5/15
Nearby suppression radius changed to 13 (except maxim HMG)
Min / Max Bursts unified

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:13 PMCruzz

Glad to hear you're so good at this game you never have fights against 2 or more grenadiers (or JLI or Obers or Stormtroopers) while not being in green cover.

Blobbing makes no difference against this, except from the axis side where you will start getting aoe suppression as you gather up more and more grens. Two grens to suppress one squad, but three grens can already handle two squads.

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:10 PMJustin xv

And the times cover isn't available just have to suck it up and get suppressed?

Lol good logic, cover must be everywhere or you're a n00b for not using it. Nice...

Jump back to quoted post29 Jun 2015, 19:10 PMTatatala

I think you fail to understand what's actually happening here. Blobbing is nothing to do with it.