2v2 review
28 May 2015, 08:15 AM
#1
Posts: 6
Hey been playing some Axis now with my mate and we are trying to improve.
Probably more replays will come, but this is the first.
Would be great to get some feedback, on what we could improve.
Any particular timings, scouting, build orders, positions, whatever comes up your mind!
No idea about the skill of the ones we are facing.
Doctrines, builds, openings.
All feedback is welcome.
29 May 2015, 17:17 PM
#2
4
Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1
I'll review this this weekend, after I have some free time.
31 May 2015, 10:49 AM
#3
4
Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1
You guys had a pretty great start for axis. You moved your units together, then pushed together and capped the entirety of the map quickly, due to your opponent's odd 2 RE -> pathfinder opening.
At this point, you guys started making bad calls. Even though you knew that your opponent not only went for soviet T1 and had access to guard motor, you decide to start building many mg42 bunkers. MG42 bunkers cost 60mu and 150mp to build, and are countered with a single 45 mu satchel charge, an AT gun, or flanking. The bunkers lost you a large amount of munitions and manpower throughout the game, for no reason whatsoever when an mg42 would have been far more useful. If you want to build mg bunkers, here are some tips:
-Always have the player who went for CAS build them, since they have access to fuel conversion.
-When placing bunkers, make sure that you make flanking routes unviable with barbed wire and mines.
-Don't use bunkers as you only line of defense. Have an infantry mg42 in front, with an mg bunker behind to fend off flanks. Have a pio flamer nearby to spot for the defense, and to discourage suppressed units grenading your mg42. Optionally add a mortar to bleed suppressed enemies. Have a pak parked nearby to damage armor.
-These tips may seem like an excesive cost for a defensive line, but they are important. This is called defense in depth, and it allows your defensive line to respond to multiple threats and work at its utmost efficiency.
You guys did not tech complimentary. What does this mean? This means that you should fill in each other's gaps with your respective teching, allowing you each to focus on one thing. For example, in this game, you both went t2 even though one of you had CAS and one of you had a doctrine with tank smoke. You biggest headache that game was the enemy 3x pathfinder + bar blob. All you needed to kill it was a single P4. If the CAS player had built t2 and a pak or 2, to counter light armor while the other player went for a quick Panzer 4 through T3, you could have wrecked your opponents' infantry heavy army AND the first Sherman, potentially winning you the game.
At around 15 minutes, your ally gets assaulted by both of your enemies, and loses just about his whole army, including 2 pak guns. One of these guns is destroyed, but both could easily have been captured by your enemies if they had been paying attention. All you had to do was take 3 seconds to target a stuka mg strafe at the enemy pathfinder horde, and your ally would not have lost 800mp + worth of units.
Good useage of the flamer HT through the game to deal damage.
You do a good job by destroyed an early SU85 from your enemy, but continue to blob your 3 lmg grens and 2-3 pshreck pgrens around the battlefield, even though you know that your opponents have access to T4, and thus, Katyushas. This leads to several unit wipes through the game from Sherman HE rounds and mortar fire, for no reason. Pgrens w/ shrecks are not a blob unit. They are far too expensive and fragile for this. Pgrens are specialists, use them behind LOS blockers to ambush enemy armor, and to support Pak40s from being flanked. Never buy more than 2, since pgrens will bleed manpower.
Your ally, who went Spearhead (w/ tiger) not only buys 2 mortar HT, which is overkill, but he also techs to T4 and buys a Brummbar. A Brummbar is much more expensive than the first tiger, and less effective vs. armor as well. The Brummbar ends up dying to an overexertion, because it hits a mine when there is an upgraded pio squad right next to it.
The resulting delay on his tiger causes it to come out very late in the game, when your opponents had 2 Shermans, 1 Jackson, 1 SU85, and 2 T34/85s. He then promptly loses the tiger due to overextending it. He gets buttoned at max range, and decides not to do anything about it, and is killed by a P47 attack + mark target + 2 Shermans.
Your ally floats 900 mp while waiting for a tiger. This is pointless, as the tiger only costs 640mp. Your ally had a piteously small army, and could have purchased a new squad to help fill out his ranks at this point.
You guys had very poor pak micro. They were seldom supported, and as a result were killed quickly by roving enemy blobs. Always have paks by the majority of your army, they do no one good when they are alone.
You both went for T4, this is pointless. T4 has specialized units, which require significant fuel investments to be useful. A CAS player should never go straight to T4 unless their ally is building a Pz4 anyways. A CAS player will almost always get armor out slower than a regular player. Not to mention, double T4 leaves you vulnerable midgame due to the lack of armor to counter infantry.
Never build a bunker lategame, unless it is part of the defense I told you about earlier. bunkers die easily enough early, but lategame are killed by literally any unit except mgs and conscripts.
Throughout this game, you relied on CAS abilities:
-Always point your strikes from the closest side of the map. This way, the plane will shoot its payload faster and make them harder to dodge. This is especially useful for the Stuka CAS strafe.
-You used Stuka mg strafe well
-You used Stuka CAS strafe incorrectly. Stuka CAS should always be used on units that are not actively being monitored. If a unit is being micro ed, use the strafe behind the vehicle to punish it for retreating and force it to move towards your AT.
-Never use Stuka bombing strike on mobile units. Yes, it could hit, but most likely your opponent will notice and dodge it, wasting 180 of your munitions.
Other than that, you guys did a good job coordinating, and just need practice. Keep it up! :}
At this point, you guys started making bad calls. Even though you knew that your opponent not only went for soviet T1 and had access to guard motor, you decide to start building many mg42 bunkers. MG42 bunkers cost 60mu and 150mp to build, and are countered with a single 45 mu satchel charge, an AT gun, or flanking. The bunkers lost you a large amount of munitions and manpower throughout the game, for no reason whatsoever when an mg42 would have been far more useful. If you want to build mg bunkers, here are some tips:
-Always have the player who went for CAS build them, since they have access to fuel conversion.
-When placing bunkers, make sure that you make flanking routes unviable with barbed wire and mines.
-Don't use bunkers as you only line of defense. Have an infantry mg42 in front, with an mg bunker behind to fend off flanks. Have a pio flamer nearby to spot for the defense, and to discourage suppressed units grenading your mg42. Optionally add a mortar to bleed suppressed enemies. Have a pak parked nearby to damage armor.
-These tips may seem like an excesive cost for a defensive line, but they are important. This is called defense in depth, and it allows your defensive line to respond to multiple threats and work at its utmost efficiency.
You guys did not tech complimentary. What does this mean? This means that you should fill in each other's gaps with your respective teching, allowing you each to focus on one thing. For example, in this game, you both went t2 even though one of you had CAS and one of you had a doctrine with tank smoke. You biggest headache that game was the enemy 3x pathfinder + bar blob. All you needed to kill it was a single P4. If the CAS player had built t2 and a pak or 2, to counter light armor while the other player went for a quick Panzer 4 through T3, you could have wrecked your opponents' infantry heavy army AND the first Sherman, potentially winning you the game.
At around 15 minutes, your ally gets assaulted by both of your enemies, and loses just about his whole army, including 2 pak guns. One of these guns is destroyed, but both could easily have been captured by your enemies if they had been paying attention. All you had to do was take 3 seconds to target a stuka mg strafe at the enemy pathfinder horde, and your ally would not have lost 800mp + worth of units.
Good useage of the flamer HT through the game to deal damage.
You do a good job by destroyed an early SU85 from your enemy, but continue to blob your 3 lmg grens and 2-3 pshreck pgrens around the battlefield, even though you know that your opponents have access to T4, and thus, Katyushas. This leads to several unit wipes through the game from Sherman HE rounds and mortar fire, for no reason. Pgrens w/ shrecks are not a blob unit. They are far too expensive and fragile for this. Pgrens are specialists, use them behind LOS blockers to ambush enemy armor, and to support Pak40s from being flanked. Never buy more than 2, since pgrens will bleed manpower.
Your ally, who went Spearhead (w/ tiger) not only buys 2 mortar HT, which is overkill, but he also techs to T4 and buys a Brummbar. A Brummbar is much more expensive than the first tiger, and less effective vs. armor as well. The Brummbar ends up dying to an overexertion, because it hits a mine when there is an upgraded pio squad right next to it.
The resulting delay on his tiger causes it to come out very late in the game, when your opponents had 2 Shermans, 1 Jackson, 1 SU85, and 2 T34/85s. He then promptly loses the tiger due to overextending it. He gets buttoned at max range, and decides not to do anything about it, and is killed by a P47 attack + mark target + 2 Shermans.
Your ally floats 900 mp while waiting for a tiger. This is pointless, as the tiger only costs 640mp. Your ally had a piteously small army, and could have purchased a new squad to help fill out his ranks at this point.
You guys had very poor pak micro. They were seldom supported, and as a result were killed quickly by roving enemy blobs. Always have paks by the majority of your army, they do no one good when they are alone.
You both went for T4, this is pointless. T4 has specialized units, which require significant fuel investments to be useful. A CAS player should never go straight to T4 unless their ally is building a Pz4 anyways. A CAS player will almost always get armor out slower than a regular player. Not to mention, double T4 leaves you vulnerable midgame due to the lack of armor to counter infantry.
Never build a bunker lategame, unless it is part of the defense I told you about earlier. bunkers die easily enough early, but lategame are killed by literally any unit except mgs and conscripts.
Throughout this game, you relied on CAS abilities:
-Always point your strikes from the closest side of the map. This way, the plane will shoot its payload faster and make them harder to dodge. This is especially useful for the Stuka CAS strafe.
-You used Stuka mg strafe well
-You used Stuka CAS strafe incorrectly. Stuka CAS should always be used on units that are not actively being monitored. If a unit is being micro ed, use the strafe behind the vehicle to punish it for retreating and force it to move towards your AT.
-Never use Stuka bombing strike on mobile units. Yes, it could hit, but most likely your opponent will notice and dodge it, wasting 180 of your munitions.
Other than that, you guys did a good job coordinating, and just need practice. Keep it up! :}
1 Jun 2015, 15:37 PM
#4
Posts: 6
Good stuff, and feedback!
We have already started to improve in some areas, and some we still need to more pratice.
Been working on the Stuka CAS, it's somewhat better.
The map we don't really have an idea, we take away the ones we usualyl loose on. Wich is is more favorable for allies than axis?
And thanks again for the feedback!
We have already started to improve in some areas, and some we still need to more pratice.
Been working on the Stuka CAS, it's somewhat better.
The map we don't really have an idea, we take away the ones we usualyl loose on. Wich is is more favorable for allies than axis?
And thanks again for the feedback!
4 Jun 2015, 08:51 AM
#5
4
Posts: 1194 | Subs: 1
Allies usually ant to have large maps with many flanking routes and easily accessible cutoffs, while Axis usually wants more focused maps that have easier to defend points. Axis maps also typically favor long range combat, while Allied maps have close range.
Veto for Axis:
Vaux Farmland
Ettelbruck Station
Trois Ponts
Semoisky Winter
Veto for Allies:
Crossing in the Woods
Minsk Pocket
Rails and Metal
Road to Kharkov
These are of course just personal preferences, and quite vague at that. OKW, USF, OST, and SOV all have different strengths, and some will favor different maps from their counterpart. For example, Trois Ponts is a very nice map for the soviets due to shock troops and 120mm, but is hard for the USF because of how hard it is for USF to attack OKW forward HQs with indirect fire.
Veto for Axis:
Vaux Farmland
Ettelbruck Station
Trois Ponts
Semoisky Winter
Veto for Allies:
Crossing in the Woods
Minsk Pocket
Rails and Metal
Road to Kharkov
These are of course just personal preferences, and quite vague at that. OKW, USF, OST, and SOV all have different strengths, and some will favor different maps from their counterpart. For example, Trois Ponts is a very nice map for the soviets due to shock troops and 120mm, but is hard for the USF because of how hard it is for USF to attack OKW forward HQs with indirect fire.
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