did the ESL get cancelled ? (officially)

Chess is competetive. Chess is balanced.

I understand there are "competetive" players (meaning those who want to make a living playing) who approach a game from the perspective of which is most popular and lucrative, in terms of what to dedicate theirntime and effort to.

But.

There are however fking Minecraft players too who make a living simply off that.
Pewdiepie, doesnt have a competetive bone in his entire body.

If Relic has some spare thousands to drop on the game for promotion and advertisement, why not. Its the best product they have, regardless of whether it is considered "hip" by the co petetive community or not. You use what you have. Its readily clear, insofar as viewer numbers, that the balance/"designed competiviness" is not the bottom line.

Some people seem to be losing perspective of the larger picture.
Tournaments/streams are about entertainment value, not "competitiveness".

If it was only about an immaculate balance/competition quotient, we would all be watching chess.
And no, we aint. Why? Because its about as entertaining to the average viewer, as watching paint dry.

My point was that there is no need for tourneys because no one participates in them anyways.

My point was that there is no need for tourneys because no one participates in them anyways.

"No one" is an exaggeration.

That aside, I get your meaning.

But what then is the explanation for why they do not participate?
Because the prize is too small?
Because the viewership is too small?
Because organization is flawed?
Because the game is too "shit" in their opinion?

What is the reason for lack of turn-out?

Coh2 has numerous casters who do it for free on their own time, with just the occasional tip paid as Sub.
Even for them, participating in the tournament increases their own viewership, by means of advertising exposure under the umbrella stream of the tournament.

Furthermore, as a company with a game product, what better way to promote it than to drop some thousands on a tournament that spans several streamed matches with your logo emblazoned on it, rather than instead spending those thousands on various media/advertisement efforts that cost 10-100x more?

Your premise, and argument, are circular.
"Nobody wants to participate in a tournament, because tournaments are useless, because nobody wants to participate in them, because the tournament is useless etc..."
What instead do you propose as a way out of the logical loop that you yourself present as the problem?

The game doesn't offer much to competitive players, especially not competitive RTS players. Little developer support, paid DLC that affects gameplay, poor performance on many machines, tiny playerbase, limited ways to stand out as a player, etc.

It wasn't designed to be a competitive game.

Neither is Minecraft.

Do you see what I'm saying?

On a pragmatic level, Coh2 is riddled with RNG, but this affects BOTH sides in a competitive situation.
It is to the detriment of the competitive player, but to the benefit of the viewer in terms of an unpredictable and exciting outcome to a match.

Rationally, this random, but equal, handicap/advantage should be something that draws attention to this game.

Do we really want a "perfect" balance and system? Would that be interesting to watch?
Even SC2 undergoes constant re-balancing iterations.

If not, as I said, we would all still be watching chess.
There is more to this than immediately meets the eye.
Wrong questions are being asked.

Except the purpose of Minecraft isn't to facilitate a competition between two players.

When did I ever say RNG made CoH2 a poor competitive game? RNG is present in large amounts in the three most popular competitive games today.

People in forums like this should accept that CoH2 is not competitive or start doing something in order to change something by playing the game COMPETITIVE instead of discussing useless balance topics in forums.

You made up that loop thingy. I never said that people don't participate in tourneys because they think they're useless wtf ?

Except the purpose of Minecraft isn't to facilitate a competition between two players.

Coh2 facilitates a competition between two players.
Albeit, with RNG inbuilt, as a benefit/handicap to both players in relatively equal proportion.

This kind of lateral inequality is exactly what makes a game interesting.

Who really wants to watch a sports match between two cloned opponents playing the same faction in the same game?

Diversity, asymmetric alignments are exactly what keep everything interesting.

People in forums like this should accept that CoH2 is not competitive or start doing something in order to change something by playing the game COMPETITIVE instead of discussing useless balance topics in forums.

You made up that loop thingy. I never said that people don't participate in tourneys because they think they're useless wtf ?

You might be an excellent "competitive" PC game player, for all I know.
But you are a complete scrub at debate and argumentation.

If this was (and it is) a competitive environment, you are losing, badly.

Exactly, CoH2 is a game that is inextricably tied to competition, yet that competition is not very attractive to outsiders because

The game doesn't offer much to competitive players, especially not competitive RTS players. Little developer support, paid DLC that affects gameplay, poor performance on many machines, tiny playerbase, limited ways to stand out as a player, etc.

It wasn't designed to be a competitive game.

Coh2 facilitates a competition between two players.
Albeit, with RNG inbuilt, as a benefit/handicap to both players in relatively equal proportion.

This kind of lateral inequality is exactly what makes a game interesting.

Who really wants to watch a sports match between two cloned opponents playing the same faction in the same game?

Diversity, asymmetric alignments are exactly what keep everything interesting.

I'm not trying to initiate a forum fight but...what does this have to do with inverse post ?

@your other post

Yeah , I'm sorry I don't have your enormous experience from having posted 1xxx posts on two different accounts

Nothing, because I never said RNG had anything to do with it.

Lets be real here.

Is SC2 a "real" competitive game?

No.

Its a perpetual mish-mash of balance problems.

Its just marketed and presented better.

It offers nothing more to "competitive players" except the fact that it has managed (through marketing) to attract more viewers, and generate a wider scene of players on that premise.

You are confusing "competitiveness" with simply being more popular, due to better marketing.
The two are not the same.

"Competitive players" flood to it, because there is more money on offer, due to better promotion/marketing, and hence, a wider viewership, which inturn supports that better promotion/marketing, and thereby the "competitive players" interests.

Has nothing to do with being competitive, in and of itself, as a game, which it is not, in any ways that matter over CoH2.

"your other post

Yeah , I'm sorry I don't have your enormous experience from having posted 1xxx posts on two different accounts

Thats fine. No need to apologize. Takes practice and effort.

You just aren't very competitive or pro at this particular kind of game.

Lets be real here.

Is SC2 a "real" competitive game?

No.

Its a perpetual mish-mash of balance problems.

Its just marketed and presented better.

It offers nothing more to "competitive players" except the fact that it has managed (through marketing) to attract more viewers, and generate a wider scene of players on that premise.

You are confusing "competitiveness" with simply being more popular, due to better marketing.
The two are not the same.

"Competitive players" flood to it, because there is more money on offer, due to better promotion/marketing, and hence, a wider viewership, which inturn supports that better promotion/marketing, and thereby the "competitive players" interests.

Has nothing to do with being competitive, in and of itself, as a game, which it is not, in any ways that matter over CoH2.

The game doesn't offer much to competitive players, especially not competitive RTS players. Little developer support, paid DLC that affects gameplay, poor performance on many machines, tiny playerbase, limited ways to stand out as a player, etc.

It wasn't designed to be a competitive game.

In comparison, SC2 has good developer support with major tournament series sponsored by them and patches aimed at actively improving the quality of competitive play, no paid DLC that affects multiplayer, great performance on nearly any machine, a large playerbase, and a vast range of ways to differentiate yourself as a player thanks to the game's combination of deep macro and deep micro gameplay, cheese strategies, and the viability of a vast range of playstyles.

By a wide variety of criteria, SC2 is in fact a superior competitive game, and it's no doubt more attractive to players interested in competitive RTS play.

Let's be real here.

Is football really superior to every other sport in the world as every european says ?

I'd say yes.

My point was that there is no need for tourneys because no one participates in them anyways.

Sorry, but this is simply incorrect. Recent $1,000 tourney? They will turn up...

Let's be real here.

Is football really superior to every other sport in the world as every european says ?

I'd say yes.

Just bcs Germany (deservedly) won?..

Thats fine. No need to apologize. Takes practice and effort.

You just aren't very competitive or pro at this particular kind of game.

Let's ease it up here just a notch or three, please? Your support for COH2 is admirable - but then there is the tendency to go in for overkill...?

Conserve your energy for the next tourney, I suggest

Hm my bad in that case. I stopped following the CoH2 s scene shortly before the 1000 dollar tourney so I have no idea how it went. However I was talking about my own experience that I gained from release til Nov 2014. Every tourney that I entered during that time was lacking players.

CoH has the base for a competitive game but is lacking in the balance and dev response. It just takes time to build up a community that cares for the game