The Community and Relic.

the community forums are a collection of port-a-potties with signs taped the door saying "official" in order to contain the whining. relic has a history of avoiding posting on them when they want input, although they do skim them.

it basically lets people vent and then they go to other places (here, GR, etc) to get constructive feedback from competitive players.

edit: ive cleaned the thread

guys i know emotions are running high right now. but please instead of letting it get out of control we have a report button for posts that break forum rules please use that instead of replying to them. (i promise we do read the reports.)

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staff/users alike feel free to disagree but lets not troll/flamebait please. if you want to post somthing that you think might break the rules copy it back afterwhile see if you might change your tune.

while you can be critical of the developers lets please try to be respectful of them.

while you can be critical of the developers lets please try to be respectful of them.

Indeed, and that applies to posters too, whether senior staff or pleb, and also even if oneself is senior staff or pleb.

If people have personal butthurts, whether senior staff or pleb, take it to PM.
5k+ readers want the topic. Not complaints about your buttpain or someones inferiority complex.

Returning to topic, a re-ration of my earlier post:

_______________________________________________________________________________

Coh2.org has done enormous benefit and promotion for this game.

Ive said it before, and will never stop, how amazing this site and its community is, from the raw architecture of the site itself and its various functionalities, its (mostly) reasonable population and culture, all the way to its home grown SNF.

This is the home away from the "official" alternative site, and (no offense Relic) better in just about all ways that matter

Having said that, lets return to Hans' suggestions.

1) Engage with the Streamers of CoH2.

This carries degrees of risk when it comes to actually participating in the stream. Its an uncontrolled environment, from a company perspective, and I understand that a CM would have some serious concerns about showing up, the attention that would bring, and every single word being revised/revisited/reinterpreted into who knows what. They make a very large and prominent target for trolls. Having said that, there are two caveats:

A) I wont name any streamers specifically, but most of the prominent streamers , Im sure, would moderate extremely strictly in defence and favor of a visiting Relic CM. Trust is a hard thing on the internet. There are risks, but also, as Hans points out, enormous potential benefits. I might be wrong, but I seem to remember Noun appearing once or twice, perhaps in SNF, to drop some promotional codes?

Regardless of that, yes, showing up carries risk, but, I think it is also the future.

Streaming of games is becoming a lucrative market, in and of itself, even so far that South Park has aired an episode on the phenomenon. If I was CM, I would want to capitalize on that, and find a way to ride the wave to mutual benefit. CoH2, and Relic, is very lucky to have such quality streamers, tried and tested. Shit, Hans even visited HQ on invitation. You trusted him enough to bring him to you and meet him in person, and he has reciprocated with hundreds (if not thousands) of hours of streaming and also no doubt crucial feedback. If you cant trust him in the community (as one example in particular) then who? I said I wouldnt name, but also Ami (our beloved overlord) and ImperialDane are some of the old guard, also invited to HQ, and also countless hours of effort, contribution, streaming and feedback.

If you cant trust these guys (to have named just a few, and I apologize to those I have not, but I know who you are), then who?

How can it, in anyway, in any sense, get better than what is already available to you?
Who else..?
What more..?

Trust. Its hard. Requires a lot from both sides, but the mutual benefits are potentially enormous. Yes, these streamers are imperfect, but such is to be human. But if you give a little, it just might so happen, that you also in turn receive. Something to think about there...


B) I dont think Hans meant just showing up in the streams of prominet casters. There are other ways to support streamers. Primary would be providing DLC for them to showcase. Another option is involving streamers more prominently in conjunction with official Relic site/events. Im not CM. I aint paid to come up with these new and innovative ways. From what I know of Cynthia, I have confidence she is smart and edgy enough to think of something.

2) Feature Community Content on Facebook.

FB is a marketer/publicists/CMs wet dream come true. They would have KILLED for a free service with such phenonemenal viewer numbers and participation in previous decades.

Shameless plug upcoming, but true nonetheless.

CoH2.org (especially its trending list) and the streamers nested here, are a buffet ready for the eating.
The content just doesnt stop, day after day, really good shit coming out for free.
(Except poor Ami, who has to pay for the site).

You cant buy this kind of content. And yet here it is, everyday, by the bucket load, for fucking free.

The invitation has been sent.
The table is set.
All your friends are already seated.
The content is real, delicious and free.

What are you waiting for?

DIG IN ALREADY!

I would stream if that would help relic an any way. I support relic as much as I can, I just want them to just simply be more active. I love company of heroes deeply and I've practically played it everyday since release, it hurts to watch the community and love for the product die around me

Did you guys know that COH2 is actually banned in Russia?

Too much antihistorical crap is an obvious bad start for a history based game

They based COH2 on stupid Enemy at the gates movie (two men sniper squad rings a bell)

It went downhill from that

Did you guys know that COH2 is actually banned in Russia?

Too much antihistorical crap is an obvious bad start for a history based game

They based COH2 on stupid Enemy at the gates movie (two men sniper squad rings a bell)

It went downhill from that

I have seen the BAD COMEDIAN's video, I don't know what to say. Sega has said that they will investigate, I don't know if they did or not.

I'd say Relic was pretty generous to the Red Army in CoH2, if historical record is anything to go by.

I'd say Relic was pretty generous to the Red Army in CoH2, if historical record is anything to go by.

Did vCOH imply that British's retaliation bombing German civilians?

I would like to know what is this historical Truth about the Red Army that is known only in Russia?

I would like to know what is this historical Truth about the Red Army that is known only in Russia?

The whole story of the Red Army is mired in post-Communism hold over as well as these days there being a lucrative business in commemoration, so it's got a lot of people interested in portraying Red Army in a good light.

Attitudes vary wildly. One website I've run across claims that the Great Patriotic War (as 1941-45 is thought of in Russia) was won solely through the heroism of the Red Army. (I might have a great fascination with the Red Army, but I'd be the first to admit that this is patently false). On the other hand you've got people who will admit to bad things happening. The Academic's view of this also varies, some will completely deny bad things happening (in particular referring to War Crimes in Germany during the Red Army's advance there), others will admit it freely.

Here's one quote from a book called: "Through the Maelstrom" which is the memoir of Boris Gorbachevsky, a veteran of the war and who actually took part in a genuine human wave assault in late 1942:

"Unfortunately the Russian Press has been concealing the truth about the Red Army for more than 60 years
...
In 2005, a 2005 video conference of Russian and German historians on topical questions of the Second World War took place in Moscow and Berlin. A Russian Historian from the state Humanitarian University, Elena Siniavskaya... acknowledged only isolated cases of inhumane treatment on the part of Soviet servicemen toward the local population and maintained that they have been fully prosecuted all the way up to military tribunals. I won't argue with Elena Siniavskaia or make accusations against her. It's a pointless venture. I'll assume she doesn't know the real facts."

The Documentary Soviet Storm, a very interesting doco if it does some what get overly dramatic, plays the whole problem of Soviet War Crimes rather interestingly, in that it acknowledges it, but instead of going into detail, instead harps on how the Germans had it coming because of what they had done in Russia. Fair enough, that's part of why the Red Army soldiers did it, but don't use it to excuse the red army's crimes.

I'm going to go out on a limb here, but I believe the interest in promoting the good side of the Red Army is part of Mr Putin's plan to restore Russian pride or whatever. That use of history just strikes me as a leading to dangerous areas. In Australia we have the same problem, where we're fed nonsense about this "Anzac Spirit" which is meant to make us better soldiers than anyone else. Thus making us feel special or something. Given this is a forum dedicated to World War II, I don't think it'll take too long to realise how preposterous an idea it is.

I've only seen part of Bad Comedian's video, it was too painful to watch. What I did see was pure sophistry. I do remember one line where he said that the line where the Soviet soldier in the first mission didn't have a weapon was nonsense. In fact he's wrong on that score and quotes some statistic totally unrelated to Stalingrad to prove it. Whilst in films like Enemy at the Gates, the problems of weapons shortages is exaggerated, there were shortages. When the 13th Guards Rifle Division crossed the Volga early on in the Stalingrad campaign (though actually attacked in the exact place where the first campaign mission starts, right up through Fallen Fighters square towards the train station), only 9 in 10 men had a weapon. The rest, as above, was sophistry.

I can imagine him getting into quite a tizzy about the execution of the partisans. That was basically nonsense, but it does kinda represent how the Armia Krajowa was screwed over by the Red Army during the Warsaw Uprising. None the less, rather badly judged by Relic.

The campaign itself, could have been done way better, but it didn't go into a tenth of the bad stuff the Soviets did in World War II. The Russians got off relatively lightly in that campaign. (Rapes, Katyn massacre anyone?)

This post might rub a few egos. Guys, the evidence for the Red Army's crimes is strong and conclusive. Denying it is nonsense and an insult to the German and Axis countries who suffered under it.

Further addendum for our German fanboys. The Soviet Warcrimes weren't a tenth of what the Germans did and intended to do in Russia. The historical revisionism relating to the Nazis and the Wehrmacht is creepy and concerning. You can't explain away the planned deaths of 40 million people. Neither was the Wehrmacht at all innocent.

Is CoH2 actually 'banned' in Russia? I thought its original distributor had simply stopped distribution because of political disagreements. That's not the same as a product being banned. Is it available on Steam in Russia?

Apologies if my information is inaccurate. I had not heard of a full ban (which seems highly excessive).

The whole story of the Red Army is mired in post-Communism hold over as well as these days there being a lucrative business in commemoration, so it's got a lot of people interested in portraying Red Army in a good light.

Attitudes vary wildly. One website I've run across claims that the Great Patriotic War (as 1941-45 is thought of in Russia) was won solely through the heroism of the Red Army. (I might have a great fascination with the Red Army, but I'd be the first to admit that this is patently false). On the other hand you've got people who will admit to bad things happening. The Academic's view of this also varies, some will completely deny bad things happening (in particular referring to War Crimes in Germany during the Red Army's advance there), others will admit it freely.

Here's one quote from a book called: "Through the Maelstrom" which is the memoir of Boris Gorbachevsky, a veteran of the war and who actually took part in a genuine human wave assault in late 1942:

"Unfortunately the Russian Press has been concealing the truth about the Red Army for more than 60 years
...
In 2005, a 2005 video conference of Russian and German historians on topical questions of the Second World War took place in Moscow and Berlin. A Russian Historian from the state Humanitarian University, Elena Siniavskaya... acknowledged only isolated cases of inhumane treatment on the part of Soviet servicemen toward the local population and maintained that they have been fully prosecuted all the way up to military tribunals. I won't argue with Elena Siniavskaia or make accusations against her. It's a pointless venture. I'll assume she doesn't know the real facts."

The Documentary Soviet Storm, a very interesting doco if it does some what get overly dramatic, plays the whole problem of Soviet War Crimes rather interestingly, in that it acknowledges it, but instead of going into detail, instead harps on how the Germans had it coming because of what they had done in Russia. Fair enough, that's part of why the Red Army soldiers did it, but don't use it to excuse the red army's crimes.

I'm going to go out on a limb here, but I believe the interest in promoting the good side of the Red Army is part of Mr Putin's plan to restore Russian pride or whatever. That use of history just strikes me as a leading to dangerous areas. In Australia we have the same problem, where we're fed nonsense about this "Anzac Spirit" which is meant to make us better soldiers than anyone else. Thus making us feel special or something. Given this is a forum dedicated to World War II, I don't think it'll take too long to realise how preposterous an idea it is.

I've only seen part of Bad Comedian's video, it was too painful to watch. What I did see was pure sophistry. I do remember one line where he said that the line where the Soviet soldier in the first mission didn't have a weapon was nonsense. In fact he's wrong on that score and quotes some statistic totally unrelated to Stalingrad to prove it. Whilst in films like Enemy at the Gates, the problems of weapons shortages is exaggerated, there were shortages. When the 13th Guards Rifle Division crossed the Volga early on in the Stalingrad campaign (though actually attacked in the exact place where the first campaign mission starts, right up through Fallen Fighters square towards the train station), only 9 in 10 men had a weapon. The rest, as above, was sophistry.

I can imagine him getting into quite a tizzy about the execution of the partisans. That was basically nonsense, but it does kinda represent how the Armia Krajowa was screwed over by the Red Army during the Warsaw Uprising. None the less, rather badly judged by Relic.

The campaign itself, could have been done way better, but it didn't go into a tenth of the bad stuff the Soviets did in World War II. The Russians got off relatively lightly in that campaign. (Rapes, Katyn massacre anyone?)

This post might rub a few egos. Guys, the evidence for the Red Army's crimes is strong and conclusive. Denying it is nonsense and an insult to the German and Axis countries who suffered under it.

Further addendum for our German fanboys. The Soviet Warcrimes weren't a tenth of what the Germans did and intended to do in Russia. The historical revisionism relating to the Nazis and the Wehrmacht is creepy and concerning. You can't explain away the planned deaths of 40 million people. Neither was the Wehrmacht at all innocent.

Thanks! I agree with your statement.

That Katyn monument, they should put rifle in the ass so its more historically accurate

I don't understand what you mean here? but tread carefully, beacuse the topic of Katyń is very delicate.